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Topic: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

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  1. #1
    andyt
    Guest

    Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    When adding ambience to dry samples I was wondering if anyone could give me some basic advice on use of reverb.

    Specifically I am wondering whether all instruments are sent to the same reverb unit / or instance of reverb (if SW based) ... or whether each instrument / section should have its own instance of reverb.

    I do understand varying the amount of signal sent, is the basic method for controlling the relative amounts of reverb added, BUT should I use different reverb units / instances for each intrsument / section ideally.

    Does a single reverb \"muddy\" the reverb sound ?

  2. #2

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    when i am doing an orchestral arrangement, i basically use four reverbs...

    three for each category, 1. for strings, 2. wood and brass, and last for percussion...

    i set different roomdepths for each categorie, also i use one reverb for wood and brass because in my orchestral placing scheme, they sit nearly in one line in terms of depth.

    the fourth reverb i use for the whole room, from the instruments to the listeners ears to get the right ambience i wanna have for the piece...

    hope that helps

  3. #3

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    With different lib\'s you sometimes have to employ different techniques. A close mic\'d lib like GOS generally requires a patch with lots of early reflections to build up the ambience. Sam on the other hand, already has the room ambience there. You may only want to add verb to place the brass further back.

    I generally add a lot of verb to percussion to place it in the back of the hall.

    I\'m no expert in this, just my experience so far. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

  4. #4

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    Hi andyt.
    Here is a recent post that may help you by Bruce Richardson . http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=005826;p=1#0000 02

    Because of his kindness to those of us with lots of questions on mixing and mastering, he has taken the time to write a small book for us . It is spread out in his many replies.
    If you browse through his replies you will see a whole lot of answers on mixing and such.
    http://www.northernsounds.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=recent_user_posts;u=00000237
    Replies to \"Newbie needs help\" or \"How to mix properly\" usually contain advice.

    What I have gathered myself in reverb, as simple as it may be and already stated, Is instruments up front in an orchestra need a dryer reverb, instruments in the middle a little wetter and in the back need the wettest. I really notice this on the percussion. If you wet them out they seem farther away and don\'t come crashing in over the Violins. It is a fine art though.
    Good luck.

  5. #5

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    Hi,

    This is really a fine art, like 88fingers said.
    Also, I reiterate his suggestions to dig in the forum, most particularly the excellent posts by Bruce Richardson, as already stated.

    One thing you might want to consider, is that many times, just by using reverb alone, if you don\'t pay attention to EQ, you will have problems achieving something really nice. Bruce has explained many times how farther instruments loose the higher and lower frequencies (as compared to closer instruments).

    People work in different ways, and it is all a matter of finding a way of mixing that makes sense to you. Some people use different reverbs on different sections of the orchestra. Some people use the same reverb, with different wet/dry ratios.
    Personally, I think that what you should do is take the most convincing orchestral hall reverb you can, and then apply it to different sections in different ways. Closer instruments with higher predelay values (so as to hear the early reflections later, and give a sense of proximity), and less wet/dry ratio. More distant instruments with lower predelay values (I think that the early reflections should be much more indistinguishable from the direct signal, given the higher distance). Also, more wet/dry ratio, and EQ these far instruments to decrease the lower and higher frequencies, to simulate the loss of extreme frequencies by medium absortion.

    Why using the same reverb setting, do you ask? Just for consistency\'s sake, to create the illusion of instruments actually playing together in the same space. I think that if you start using different reverb patches (with different decay times, and etc), it starts being even more of an art (if that\'s even possible), to get a fairly good result.

    Sorry, I\'m talking too much, and I\'m just regurgitating what other (truly talented) people have already said before.

    Good luck!

    Ruben

  6. #6

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    Originally posted by Scott Cairns:
    With different lib\'s you sometimes have to employ different techniques. A close mic\'d lib like GOS generally requires a patch with lots of early reflections to build up the ambience.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">Sorry Scott, but GOS is all but close mic\'d.

    [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

    Alex

  7. #7

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    You might be right Lex, honestly I can\'t remember now. What I should\'ve said is that GOS is a very DRY library and it definetely does need the early reflections. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

  8. #8

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    Of course it needs reverb, every sample does...
    But GOS is pretty wet, try those pizzicatos and see for your self..

    Alex

  9. #9

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    Originally posted by lex:
    Of course it needs reverb, every sample does...
    But GOS is pretty wet, try those pizzicatos and see for your self..

    Alex
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">I didn\'t even use any verb on the last song i did with GOS,and it sounded good to me! But i only used the violins from GOS. Okay, let me make this sound a little more clear [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] I used reverb on everything except for the GOS violins.

    I think GOS is pretty ambient. Afterall, why do you think Gary went to the expense to record his samples at Lincoln Center?

    Rick

  10. #10

    Re: Use of Reverb on Orchestral Music

    Of course it needs reverb, every sample does...
    But GOS is pretty wet, try those pizzicatos and see for your self..
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">And what about the rest of the library? You\'re singling out one sample out of the thousands in the library.

    Maybe I\'m not making myself clear. GOS does NOT have room ambience built in to the samples in the way that a library like SAM does. Therefore it helps to add the early reflections in. This is a trick I learnt from folk here I might add. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img]

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