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Topic: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

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  1. #1

    User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    While I know Nuendo is not the first choice for extensive midi work, protools isn\'t much better in that regard, so perhaps many here work with neither, but those who sequence in one machine and mix in another system will probably have some interesting insights here. I\'ll get the ball rolling a bit:

    I believe proprietary developement is out-dated and difficult to deal with in regards to plugins and effects of all sorts. From what I\'ve heard, Nuendo 2 sounds every bit as good (if not better) than ProTools. Nuendo, a nice set of Plugins, and a machine to run them well on is considerably less expensive than ProTools. Factor in 5.1 mixing and video capabilities, and there really seems no reason to pay so much for \"protools\" because of the name and hardware, when its competition is doing it smarter, better, and for less.

    (I was in an argument with a bass player friend of mine today about this and I swear, trying to convince a ProTools user like him that something else might be better is like trying to convince a hardcore bible-thumper to admit to the \"possibility\" that there is no god! It was rough...)

    Anyway, I\'d like to hear more about this, and maybe get some more ammunition for my next argument, because it will come... they always do. Or perhaps I\'ll be persuaded otherwise?

    mike

  2. #2

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    just give up [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

    Use the stuff you think is better and let them get left in the dust

    I personally think Pro Tools is an over priced platform, but I honestly shouldn\'t say that too loud for fear of digidesign actually hearing me as they are literally 2 minutes away from where I live (nice building)

    I think alot of pro toolers know that its a big standard, and that means alot of people use it for that fact. Studios exchange protools sessions and such with ease in most cases.

    Now ask me what I think of sonic Foundry Vegas and you get me to put a smile on my face

    I\'m really interested in Nuendo 2.0, so we\'ll see if I change.

  3. #3

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    Originally posted by KingIdiot:
    Now ask me what I think of sonic Foundry Vegas and you get me to put a smile on my face

    I\'m really interested in Nuendo 2.0, so we\'ll see if I change.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">Heheh, I seriously thought about mentioning Vegas here, as that is something dear to my heart for so many reasons, but for the debate I was engaged in, I knew he\'d be more wary of the name Nuendo than Vegas. But I\'d like to hear the Vegas perspective too, actually. Anything for that most precious of commodities - perspective. Really hard to come by these days it seems.

  4. #4

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    There are systems that do sound better than a Pro Tools HD system. There are audio programs that have a better sounding mix engine than Pro Tools. There are converter boxes that sound better than the Digi HD 192 box. You can have a better sounding system than a Digi HD 192 system for considerably less money.

    Samplitude and Sequoia are excellent contenders, and most likely the best. Logic and Nuendo are also good contenders as well for a great sounding mix engine. You can buy a great converter box that sounds better than the Digi HD 192 box, such as Benchmark, DB, Apogee, and Mytek. For the money RME converters are superb. You don\'t need to blow money on Prism converters, which are way overpriced and don\'t sound any better than some of the other converter boxes mentioned above, if even as good.

    If your main mission is to produce the best sounding music possible, you definitely don\'t want a Pro Tools HD system, unless you are needing compatibility with post production facilities that are using Pro Tools and Avid video systems.

    Kip McGinnis
    Bardstown Audio
    www.bardstownaudio.com

  5. #5

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    Nuendo 2 will include all the midi functionalities found in cubase SX (and even much more) [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] . I\'m a CubaseSX user (and a former VST 5.1 user) and I\'m just a happy composer/arranger. There are of course some shortcomings but a great deal of them should be addressed in Nuendo 2. Remember also that OMF is included in Nuendo, which makes it easier to transfer a Nuendo project on a Protools platform.

    Michaël

  6. #6

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    Hey Mikhail,

    I\'m an SX user too - could you tell me what is missing in Nuendo that sits it behind SX in the midi stakes? (sorry if this is too OT the OT)

  7. #7

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    I love my PT HD rig. It\'s simply great-well, it is not really cheap but for what you get it\'s fair.

    I loved Cubase on my Atari until V2 other than that, Steinberg stuff went from decent to really unstable overhyped software, ... I have not many good stories to tell about Steinberg-sorry. If you want to go for great PC stuff check out the magix stuff-great software with RME converters-absolutely PRO!!!!

    Hope this helps, Andy

  8. #8

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    Michaelangelo,

    What\'s to argue? Quite frankly, I\'ve never understood it. There\'s the Mac vs PC, this sequencer over that one, this plug-in over that, this sampling library over the other....jeeesh.

    I\'m not emotionally attached to any of it. I\'ll use what gets me work. If Nuendo was the be all, everybody would be using it. Well, they\'re not. Often, it\'s not a question of what you can afford to have, it\'s a question of what you CAN\'T afford to not have. I work in both the pop music world with bands as an engineer and mixer, and the post music-to-picture. Both worlds use Pro-Tools (on a Mac) extensively. If I want to work, that\'s what I use. If I want to work, I can\'t afford to NOT use Pro-Tools.

    You point out tracking on one system and mixing on another. Well...there ya go. I have sent a Pro-Tools session to New Zealand to have a track recorded and sent back. The same session had a track recorded in New York by another musician. Then sent around to various people in L.A. The whole thing then mixed in a SIlver Lake home. Everybody uses Pro-Tools....and some of them simply used a cheap Pro-Tools LE system using good converters.

    If everybody switched to Nuendo, or some yet to be developed software, then that\'s what would be used.

    As far as \"outdated proprietary systems\", well, it seems to me that Steinberg is the one losing business and may not be long for this world. Audio Units on the Mac have replaced VST. And any plug-in or softsynth that doesn\'t use audio units or doesn\'t work on Pro-Tools isn\'t worth having.

    Now, I\'m not a die-hard Mac-head either. If people in mass around here used PC\'s...including all the dubbing studios, and/or music recording studios, then I\'d switch to PC tomorrow. Fact is, they don\'t. They use Macs and Pro-Tools. So if you want to bring your projects in to be mixed in a good environment, you better have it on a Pro-Tools session.

    When GigaStudio came out, it was the single piece of software that I had to have a PC for. I didn\'t hesitate to buy the PC and Giga. I also think the PC is better than Mac, or Mac is better than PC arguments are silly. Who gets emotionally attached to their equipment?

    Bottom line...if you are working by yourself on your own projects, then get whatever moves you. If you are likely to share projects in the world and work with a number of people, you work on Pro-Tools. It\'s the music that matters, not the software/hardware. As a sometimes engineer, I can tell you that it is hard for me to f*** up great sounding tracks that are played well. Conversely, there is not much I can do with tracks or songs that suck.

    As far as sequencing midi, use something else and import the end result into pro-tools. I use Logic for that purpose, and sometimes just import the Audio data into pro-tools for mix-down or sharing....or, just mix right inside Logic when I\'m working on my own. I\'ve never used Pro-Tools for midi stuff.

    That\'s my rant about this subject. Certainly not meant to be personal or anything. Sometimes these decisions are made FOR you, not by you.

    In the editing world, this same thing goes on in the Final Cut vs Avid argument. Pros use Avid, even though Final Cut is a fraction of the price and seemingly just as powerful. As long as Avid rules the roost, ProTools will be there for audio.

  9. #9

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD


  10. #10

    Re: User Opinions - Nuendo 2 vs ProTools HD

    Originally posted by Runyon:
    What\'s to argue? Quite frankly, I\'ve never understood it. There\'s the Mac vs PC, this sequencer over that one, this plug-in over that, this sampling library over the other....jeeesh.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">The purpose behind posting this was not to argue about which was better at all. I was simply shocked to hear someone I respected as somewhat knowledgeable tell me that in order to have a \"real\" studio, I had to \"upgrade from SX\" and use ProTools, and that Nuendo couldn\'t cut it either. This is of course an absurd statement, but I discovered during the course of the debate that I didn\'t know enough about the options to present a strong case. This forum is filled with all kinds of different folks doing different things, and each has different needs. So I thought it a great place to find out who used what and why.

    Originally posted by Runyon:
    Often, it\'s not a question of what you can afford to have, it\'s a question of what you CAN\'T afford to not have. I work in both the pop music world with bands as an engineer and mixer, and the post music-to-picture. Both worlds use Pro-Tools (on a Mac) extensively. If I want to work, that\'s what I use. If I want to work, I can\'t afford to NOT use Pro-Tools.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">Very good point, and it makes total sense for someone in that situation.

    Originally posted by Runyon:
    And any plug-in or softsynth that doesn\'t use audio units or doesn\'t work on Pro-Tools isn\'t worth having.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">Kind of a bold statement, don\'t ya think? (While you do make some good points, this statement is a little ridiculous imo.)

    Originally posted by Runyon:
    Now, I\'m not a die-hard Mac-head either. If people in mass around here used PC\'s...including all the dubbing studios, and/or music recording studios, then I\'d switch to PC tomorrow. Fact is, they don\'t. They use Macs and Pro-Tools. So if you want to bring your projects in to be mixed in a good environment, you better have it on a Pro-Tools session.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">For right now, yes. I\'ve been constantly surprised that large budgets would be wasted away on a PT system when you can get everything it can do and more, for many thousands less... Until the compatability issues were pointed out, and then it made more sense. People cling to standards for the many benefits, but it does have serious downsides: just look at the good ol\' Floppy drive for example. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img] I mean, there has to come a time when something gives and people migrate to a new standard that is better in ways that do matter to them, such as price. I\'d never support changing just for price, but if all else is basically equal...what would you be losing?

    Originally posted by Runyon:
    Bottom line...if you are working by yourself on your own projects, then get whatever moves you. It\'s the music that matters, not the software/hardware.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">I totally agree with that. That is the very point I was trying to make with the guy I was arguing with. He\'s a bit brainwashed by the PT dominance into truly believing that it is fundamentally a better system than anything else out there. Hence, I wanted to see what folks that chose PT over others, or others over PT, had to say about their decisions.


    Originally posted by Runyon:
    That\'s my rant about this subject. Certainly not meant to be personal or anything. Sometimes these decisions are made FOR you, not by you.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">Nothing personal at all, and in my case, finances restrict me from owning my own PT system even if I wanted one. I use the school\'s when I need, but in most every respect, my home setup can simply do more. (At least, it can do more of what I need to do, which is a much more accurate statement.)

    I think we can definitely agree that this is an \"each to his own\" situation, and I totally see why you would need PT for what you do. I strongly suspect that a film composer would not, but as I\'m not exactly in the 250k per movie circle of friends, I can\'t say that for certain.

    and btw... My name is Mike, I\'m emotionally attatched to my gear, and I\'m proud of it! [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

    Thanks for all the info so far everybody, this is becoming pretty informative actually...

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