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Topic: GPO4 note volume inconsistencies in Sibelius 7

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  1. #1

    Question GPO4 note volume inconsistencies in Sibelius 7

    Hi there,

    While composing on Sibelius 7, I have found that different notes of most GPO4 instruments play at different volumes, regardless of the dynamic that I've set (e.g. p, pp, ff, etc.)

    For example, the note C may play at the volume that I've set (let's say p), but the next note above it (C#) will suddenly play louder afterwards, as if it's an ff (there is a really noticeable difference.)

    I'm not sure why it's doing this, but it happens across most instruments I use. I noticed, however, that when I'm playing back what I've written on Sibelius, the third pedal icon on the end of the piano roll on the ARIA player (circled in red on attached picture) turns on when the extra loud notes play. I'm not sure if this has anything to do with why these notes play louder than they should. Also, the mod wheel (circled in green on attached picture) also changes when the extra loud notes play. If any of these two things are the root of my problem then I have no idea how to fix it!



    Any help would be greatly appreciated, It's very hard to compose something when you're constantly having to change the volume of each individual note because of their inconsistencies.

    Thanks

  2. #2

    Re: GPO4 note volume inconsistencies in Sibelius 7

    Quote Originally Posted by Spacktardius View Post
    ... the note C may play at the volume that I've set (let's say p), but the next note above it (C#) will suddenly play louder afterwards, as if it's an ff... the mod wheel (circled in green on attached picture) also changes when the extra loud notes play...


    I'll tell you what's going on "under the hood"--it may help you track down what's wrong either in your score, or in your instrument definition file. Extra data is being generated somehow.

    MIDI Controller #1, or #11 (they both behave identically) controls the volume of GPO instruments. The virtual mod wheel you have pictured reflects the current state of CC1 or 11 in a project. The mod wheel is jumping up because there's data controlling it to do that, and your instruments will be Much louder in response.

    I use DAW software where all we do is work with MIDI data, and things are much more straightforward. When we want to record the dynamic volume control of an instrument, we just record it in real time with our keyboard mod wheels. In notation, where you're having to do with inserting dynamic markings, hairpins etc - it can be like trying to manipulate fine controls while wearing over sized mittens. I sympathize.

    But that's what's happening, "under the hood," as I said. You need to see if there are dynamic markings somewhere in your file causing CC1 to be triggered like that - or you need to find out why your instrument definition file for GPO is apparently misbehaving.

    The Sibelius Forum is highly recommended for unraveling this problem. In my experience, there are very knowledgeable users there who respond fairly quickly to problems.

    EDIT: By the way, since that pedal is also turning on, that means that CC #64 is also being triggered. That's sustain - but it doesn't effect volume.

    Randy

  3. #3

    Re: GPO4 note volume inconsistencies in Sibelius 7

    Quote Originally Posted by rbowser- View Post
    EDIT: By the way, since that pedal is also turning on, that means that CC #64 is also being triggered. That's sustain - but it doesn't effect volume.
    Randy
    Sorry for the very late comment. I've mostly been away from the forum for quite a while.

    Randy's comment about CC#64 (CC#68 in the Notation libraries) is significant. A little over 2 years ago the Garritan developers mentioned to Sibelius developers (and I'm sure I'm severly paraphrasing here) that there is some unwelcome interaction between the Legato control (CC#64 / CC#68) and volume on some instruments. (It is a fairly severe problem with solo strings. I don't know what other instruments are effected.) Each set of developers said the problem should be addressed by the other and nothing was ever done to fix it. It is not a problem with Finale so I assume Finale does not use the Legato control.
    The bottom line: if you are going to use slurs / phrase marks in Sibelius and want to have dynamic work correctly during playback you have to play games.
    1. You can tell Sibelius to not play the slurs, and then increase the duration of the individual notes so that they overlap (which is what I assume happens in Finale).
    2. You can change the definition of slur in the Playback Dictionary so that it does not turn on the legato control.
    3. You can change Sibelius' GPO4 Sound Set to remove legato control from the instruments exibiting this problem.

    None of these is particularly fun.

    Pat

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