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Topic: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

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  1. #1

    JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Hi,
    Tried to ask the question in the JABB forum with no reply, I'll try here.

    question is more to Sibelius users - but maybe one of you had the chance to experience Jabb3+Sibelius7:
    If I'm using Sibelius with Sibelius sounds - in order to hear the continuing snare stim rolling brush - I just need to use the snare note with notation type="shape note 5" (or alt+shift+20).

    When I open sibelius7 and choose instrument from Jabb3 - I have no problems with pitched sounds, but when I choose unpitch sounds like drums - there is no connection between the note the I choose on sibelius and the actual note played on the Jabb3.
    Therefore - when using Jabb sound "01-Brush Drum set 1", If I press on the Aria engine on note C#1 - I can hear the beutiful continuing stim brush rolling snare,
    but none of the notes in Sibelius7 generates this C#1 note inside JABB.
    After reading the JABB User manual -
    I tried several ways to produce this sound by sending ~C1 message or trying adding "BRSH" to the note, even played with the allocation of the sameples Engine inside sibelius - but none seems to work.

    My questions are:
    1) Does anyone could generate this stim snare sound from Sibelius?
    BTW, There are other JABB drum notes that I couldn't generate through Sibelius.
    2) Is there anyway to map the drums keys chromatically in parrallel to the real keys of the Garritan JABB?
    I mean - when choosing the note "C#1" in Sibelius -
    it will actually play the sound of this note in JABB?
    D will play D, etc...
    I found out in Sibelius Edit Instrument that I can choose in strument to be Chromaticaly but the instruments I can choose under "best instrument" are just the real chromatic instruments (horns, saxs, keyboards, guitar...) - no drums.

    Please help
    thanks in advance
    Jerome

  2. #2

    Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Hi, Jerome - I'm afraid I don't have an answer for you. I'm still using Sib 5, but have never tried to use JABB percussion in it. Maybe I could run an experiment, see what happens, and then report - in case what I come up with applies to Sib 7.

    All I know is that dealing with percussion in Sib is always difficult. Basically, as long as I use GM 1 drums, then I can get on with what I need to do - But I don't care what the playback sounds like in Sib, I just use it for getting print outs when needed.

    Let me see if I can find out anything.

    EDIT: I'm back already to say I'm unable to help you out. I was in too big of a hurry earlier, not keeping in mind that when I use Sibelius, I still rely on Native Instruments' Kontakt Player for playing instruments. That's the sampler that Garritan Libraries used to be hosted by, but now they're all accessed through Aria. I've never tried to see if I can get Aria recognized by Sib 5, because I'm happy with the sound sets I have available. I don't rely on Sib for generating audio, just notation, and that's why I've never bothered with trying to get the best sound possible from it.

    Someone with the current Sib who is using Aria and JABB will hopefully notice your question.

    EDIT TWO:
    Your post made me more curious, so I went into Sib, set up Aria to be recognized by it (I've never done that before!) But can't figure out how to now make it see and use all my Garritan Libraries in Aria. When I set up a drum track to be played through Aria - Aria is listed in the Sib mixer, but even when I have a JABB drum set loaded in Aria, it's not really available in Sib.

    In the mixer, it shows Aria, but it also still shows the generic Rock kit - which doesn't play in Aria. Why that's listed as the sound being played through Aria when it isn't is beyond me. --- All that stuff drives me nuts, that's why I've never gone deeper into setting up sounds in Sib. I really don't care what the sounds are as long as I can recognize my music. For real music work I just have to use Sonar.--So--I tried to figure this out more for you, but have to report that I've failed!

    Randy

  3. #3

    Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Hi Randy,
    Thank you very much for all the effort given on this topic, I appreciate it!

    Few comments:
    Regarding the Sibelius siound issues you've mentioned:
    1) Drum Rock kit is added always automatically just for the Metronom Click.
    Example if you set a score of Guitar + Jazz Drums -
    you will get 3 channels - GTR+Jazz Drums + Rock kit for the metronom click sound.
    So you can ignore this channel.
    2) After creating in Sibelius new sound set called Aria - setting that the sound source is aria JABB and removed Sibelius essntial sounds from this sound set,
    most of my problems disappeared after restart to my PC.
    3) in the sibelius when I press "N" to start writing notes - I click with the mouse on the stave that I want to add the notes to - Then I can play in the keyboard and really hear the sound of the correct instrument.

    General JABB issue - (not related to Sibelius use):
    I've found that (I don't why but) if I playing in my midi keyboard,
    somehow I can hear only midi channgel 2.
    It means that only the second instrument that I choose in the Aria - I can hear when playing the midi keyboard.
    If I want to play the sound of channel 1/3/4 should I change the midi Channel inside the midi Keyboard configuration?

    Thanks again
    Jerome

  4. #4

    Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Thanks for asking the questions, Jerome - You've gotten me to try doing more with setting Garritan instruments up in Aria. Good heavens it's a convoluted process! I'm so used to the utter simplicity of using Sonar - Choose Aria, load an instrument, play. It's so straight forward.

    Opening the Sibelius PDF reference, I've gone through the process of manually setting up a JABB Ensemble pre-set, Jazz Quartet. What I wasn't doing when I tried last night, was using the Sound ID menu to name the instruments I'd already loaded in Aria.

    So now I have a Fretless bass on the default MIDI channel of 1 - Electric Piano on channel 2, and a Tenor Sax on channel 4. All of those function as expected - When I give them names in the Playback Devices pop-up, under Program they are no longer listed as (unused) but now say (unknown)- then the Sound ID is listed on the right. In Sibelius, when I either use the mouse or my MIDI keyboard, the appropriate JABB instruments play on the correct staves.

    BUT - I can't make the drums to work right. I had loaded this quartet from the Aria Ensemble menu, and the drums that are loaded with that group aren't the GM (General MIDI) version - So by hand I changed the drums to the GM version of the brush kit. By default, and keeping with MIDI convention, the drums were loaded into Aria on MIDI channel 10. Fine.

    Back in the Manual Sound Sets dialogue in Sibelius, I followed the manual's instructions. It says that instead of looking for a Sound ID in the drop down list, I need to check "General MIDI-compatible drum map." That makes sense. I click that, then click Apply. But in the list on the right hand side, even though it now says (GM drum map), under Program it still says (unused)-- Clearly that's not right.

    Back to the jazz notation page I have set up in Sibelius - My experience with the drums is now different from yours. When I click in the Drums staff with my mouse, it Does trigger the JABB drums, but when I use my MIDI keyboard, even though notes appear on the screen, no sound comes out. In the sound mixer, Drums are allocated to Aria, but for the program, (GM) is listed like that - in parenthesis -.

    Using the mouse (since the keyboard isn't triggering JABB's drums) - I can see that only some of the drum kit is being used. Snare (D1) is triggered in the third space up in the Drum staff. That's correct. And the kick drum, toms, are triggered on their correct lines or spaces- But there's no way to trigger C#1, which has the brush snare swirl you're wanting to use. Maybe if I could get my keyboard to play the drums, then all the notes would trigger sounds - but I'm totally sure of that.

    THIS is exactly why I've always just settled for whatever the heck Sibelius wants to load for instruments - As long as a sound from the appropriate family is chosen from "Sound Essentials," - I'm happy. I've poked around with this manual soundset routine before and it's always ended in frustration like this.

    I have more replies inside quotes from your last message:

    Quote Originally Posted by JeromeF View Post
    Hi Randy,
    Thank you very much for all the effort given on this topic, I appreciate it!

    Few comments:
    Regarding the Sibelius siound issues you've mentioned:
    1) Drum Rock kit is added always automatically just for the Metronom Click.
    Example if you set a score of Guitar + Jazz Drums -
    you will get 3 channels - GTR+Jazz Drums + Rock kit for the metronom click sound.
    So you can ignore this channel.
    2) After creating in Sibelius new sound set called Aria - setting that the sound source is aria JABB and removed Sibelius essntial sounds from this sound set,
    most of my problems disappeared after restart to my PC.
    Do you mean that you now are successfully playing the brush swirl that you've wanted, and the drum set is working right for you now? If so - let me know what you did! As you can see from the above - I haven't made this Aria manual sound set to totally work yet.


    Quote Originally Posted by JeromeF View Post
    General JABB issue - (not related to Sibelius use):
    I've found that (I don't why but) if I playing in my midi keyboard,
    somehow I can hear only midi channgel 2.
    It means that only the second instrument that I choose in the Aria - I can hear when playing the midi keyboard.
    If I want to play the sound of channel 1/3/4 should I change the midi Channel inside the midi Keyboard configuration?

    Thanks again
    Jerome
    Since you don't specify if this is happening when using Aria in a recording program, I think you're talking about using Aria in stand-alone mode. Is that right? - I never use the stand alone, always using Aria as a VST inside Sonar, so there may be more to this than I'm familiar with.

    But it sounds like your master keyboard is transmitting on MIDI Channel 2 instead of 1. Check what master channel it's on. And then, yes, working in this way in stand-alone, you would need to change the MIDI channel on your keyboard to match the corresponding MIDI channels of the instruments you have loaded in Aria.

    It's much simpler when Aria is used as a VST in a recording program. You add an instance of Aria to the project. Load the instruments you want. You don't have to keep the default MIDI channels assigned, but it's very convenient to just leave them as they are - MIDI channels 1 through 16 corresponding to slots 1 through 16 in Aria.

    Next thing, when using Sonar or another recording program, one wants to change the audio outputs for each instrument. They default as all coming out of one stereo channel, labeled 1/2. That's OK for working in a notation program, but ridiculous to use in a recording program. There are 16 stereo channels available, and so the instruments should be assigned (by clicking the 1/2) so that they are each on their separate stereo outs from Aria.

    In the DAW software, those Aria audio channels are assigned to 16 separate stereo audio channels. And of course each instrument needs its own separate MIDI track.--And that gets me back to your question as it applies to using Aria in a program like Sonar:

    --With each Aria instrument assigned to a different MIDI channel, and each of them having their own track in Sonar - Then the user doesn't need to ever change the transmitting channel on his master keyboard. When a MIDI track in the project is selected, the notes played are automatically transmitted to Aria on the correct MIDI channel. It's very simple and easy to set up--despite this chunk of text to describe the process.

    Jerome, if you have any more tips about using Aria in Sibelius, please let me know!

    Randy

  5. #5

    Cool Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Randy - you are so thorough!
    Always liked your answers. checking every bit and aspects. again appreciate!

    Regarding my question about the channel number - yes I mean - working with Aria as Standalone.
    I will try to change the channel through the Midi Keyboad. Thanks for the answer.

    Regarding what I wrote about most of my problems solved after restart PC -
    I've meant - the part of no sounds coming out...
    The issue regarding the C#1 stim drum is not part of it unfortunately.

    But after having deeper investigation - I found out a "kind of solution" to that stiming snare.

    As you've mentioned most of the regular drums are working - we have same situation I think (except that for me Keyboard and mouse and Midi Keyboard all generating same sounds)- when the regular Snare hit, bass drum and few tom-toms are working somehow,
    not exactly on the order of the notes I play in the keyboard but more of the notes as written for drummers.
    e.g. If I press B key in the piano (midi keyboard) - in the Aria I see the note pressed is D
    But none of the 88 keys seems to generate the stim snare C#1 key.

    So I started to experiment with the "Edit Instrument" feature in sibelius.
    This is how I "kind of" solved the problem.
    I write "kind of" becuase it's looking bad - in case I will have to give the score to a drummer - he won't understand a ---- of what I wrote, because it's just a solution of writing the notes as the Aria represent it (I mean - chromaticaly - with all the Sharps - exactly on the order of the Drum set as playing in the keyboard with Aria as stand alone).
    This is how I did it (kind of massy way):
    1) Sibelius: Edit Instrument --> New instrument --> Type Of staff=Pitched (most important)!
    Playback defaults - Best sound = Choose any JABB instrument you don't like
    (because in the list you won't find the drum sets , only pitched instruments - so you can choose JABB--> Bass clarinet)
    Give the instrument a name like DRUM BRSH2
    2) Add the instrument you've just created to the "Jazz Instruments" Ensemble under "Rhythm Section" family.
    3) Add this instrument to your piece.
    Now when you play the keyboard you will hear the Bass Clarinet.
    4) Go to Aria and manually change the B. clarinet to be Drum kit Brushes.
    Now every note you play on the keyboard actually plays same note in the Aria.
    Including that beautiful stim snare drum C#1.
    If you see the notes in sibelius outside the sheet lines (too low or too high), you can:
    Edit instrument --> Transposition section --> under Non Transposing score section -->
    Under "Written middle C sounds as" --> choose "2" instead of "4".



    I couldn't understand the part you've mentioned about the Instrument ID instead of instrument name, actually I didn't understand all this part:

    Randy: "When I give them names in the Playback Devices pop-up, under Program they are no longer listed as (unused) but now say (unknown)- then the Sound ID is listed on the right"




    Another thing I wanted to mention regarding what you've wrote that it's always much easier and better working with a DAW with JABB.
    I truely agree with you, BUT
    IMO, Working with Sibelius is much easier in the aspect of Composing & arranging.
    It's always much clear to see the whole picture in front of you.
    To see what each instrument is playing, then adding the corresponding notes to backup or to have tension or to follow the melody, or to play with the rhythms and voicing of the backing piano.
    I find it much easier to see notes of all staves in front of me.
    Where is JABB getting into picture -
    When I compose I find it really beneficial to hear good deep sounds that gives the right atmosphere, (especially if you already have the backing rhythm section - especially the Stim snare drum as a loop pathern for writing other staves)
    That's why I try to combine the great JABB sounds (thank again for your recommendation) into sibelius. Of course it is much easier to control the CC messages through Cubase 6 (very good graphically designed for controling few CC messages and view it altogether).
    I wis Sibelius will develope better engine to support these CC messages also in the future,
    Then I wouldn't have to work twice - once in Sibelius for composing and once for producing the accurate sounds with DAW.


    Thank you again Randy
    I owe you a beer
    Jerome

  6. #6

    Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Quote Originally Posted by JeromeF View Post
    Randy - you are so thorough!
    Always liked your answers. checking every bit and aspects. again appreciate!

    Regarding my question about the channel number - yes I mean - working with Aria as Standalone.
    I will try to change the channel through the Midi Keyboad. Thanks for the answer.

    Regarding what I wrote about most of my problems solved after restart PC -
    I've meant - the part of no sounds coming out...
    The issue regarding the C#1 stim drum is not part of it unfortunately.

    But after having deeper investigation - I found out a "kind of solution" to that stiming snare.

    As you've mentioned most of the regular drums are working - we have same situation I think (except that for me Keyboard and mouse and Midi Keyboard all generating same sounds)- when the regular Snare hit, bass drum and few tom-toms are working somehow,
    not exactly on the order of the notes I play in the keyboard but more of the notes as written for drummers.
    e.g. If I press B key in the piano (midi keyboard) - in the Aria I see the note pressed is D
    But none of the 88 keys seems to generate the stim snare C#1 key.

    So I started to experiment with the "Edit Instrument" feature in sibelius.
    This is how I "kind of" solved the problem.
    I write "kind of" becuase it's looking bad - in case I will have to give the score to a drummer - he won't understand a ---- of what I wrote, because it's just a solution of writing the notes as the Aria represent it (I mean - chromaticaly - with all the Sharps - exactly on the order of the Drum set as playing in the keyboard with Aria as stand alone).
    This is how I did it (kind of massy way):
    1) Sibelius: Edit Instrument --> New instrument --> Type Of staff=Pitched (most important)!
    Playback defaults - Best sound = Choose any JABB instrument you don't like
    (because in the list you won't find the drum sets , only pitched instruments - so you can choose JABB--> Bass clarinet)
    Give the instrument a name like DRUM BRSH2
    2) Add the instrument you've just created to the "Jazz Instruments" Ensemble under "Rhythm Section" family.
    3) Add this instrument to your piece.
    Now when you play the keyboard you will hear the Bass Clarinet.
    4) Go to Aria and manually change the B. clarinet to be Drum kit Brushes.
    Now every note you play on the keyboard actually plays same note in the Aria.
    Including that beautiful stim snare drum C#1.
    If you see the notes in sibelius outside the sheet lines (too low or too high), you can:
    Edit instrument --> Transposition section --> under Non Transposing score section -->
    Under "Written middle C sounds as" --> choose "2" instead of "4".



    I couldn't understand the part you've mentioned about the Instrument ID instead of instrument name, actually I didn't understand all this part:

    Randy: "When I give them names in the Playback Devices pop-up, under Program they are no longer listed as (unused) but now say (unknown)- then the Sound ID is listed on the right"




    Another thing I wanted to mention regarding what you've wrote that it's always much easier and better working with a DAW with JABB.
    I truely agree with you, BUT
    IMO, Working with Sibelius is much easier in the aspect of Composing & arranging.
    It's always much clear to see the whole picture in front of you.
    To see what each instrument is playing, then adding the corresponding notes to backup or to have tension or to follow the melody, or to play with the rhythms and voicing of the backing piano.
    I find it much easier to see notes of all staves in front of me.
    Where is JABB getting into picture -
    When I compose I find it really beneficial to hear good deep sounds that gives the right atmosphere, (especially if you already have the backing rhythm section - especially the Stim snare drum as a loop pathern for writing other staves)
    That's why I try to combine the great JABB sounds (thank again for your recommendation) into sibelius. Of course it is much easier to control the CC messages through Cubase 6 (very good graphically designed for controling few CC messages and view it altogether).
    I wis Sibelius will develope better engine to support these CC messages also in the future,
    Then I wouldn't have to work twice - once in Sibelius for composing and once for producing the accurate sounds with DAW.


    Thank you again Randy
    I owe you a beer
    Jerome
    While I'm not an expert on Sibelius and its percussion system I have fiddled around with re-mapping notes and creating new instruments etc. (Very tedious, confusing and time consuming!) My workaround works for me, maybe it'll be of some help.

    When you first set up a new score in Sibelius and a 5 line percussion staff named Drum Set is created, Sib maps the pitches according to an international drum notation standard.
    Therefore the 1st space is kick, 3rd space is snare etc. This works ok in Sib but doesn't transfer to Aria, Kontakt Player 2 etc.

    My percussion workaround:

    I've found if I create a normal Bass or Treble staff (instead of using the Drum Set staff) and set the same channels in the Sib mixer slot and the Aria slot then the pitches of the sounds I want to use in Aria sound correctly. The score plays back with the correct sounds.

    I use Aria all the time now in Sib (as well as Kontakt, Sib Essentials and GM )and I don't have to deactivate anything in the configuration setup.

    I haven't had any trouble running Aria from within Sib. I set up my staves for the score, go to the sib mixer, select Aria in the slot and set a channel number. Then I open the Aria interface, set the channel to match the Sib mixer channel and choose an instrument to load into the slot. I set up each staff this way with the instruments I want to use.

    I hope some of this helps. I really like being able to mix and match sounds from the various libraries. With GPO4, World Instruments and recently JABB3, I'm having a lot of fun!
    yjoh

    Music... A Joy For Life.

  7. #7

    Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Thanks for adding to this, Yjoh!

    You said, "...I haven't had any trouble running Aria from within Sib. I set up my staves for the score, go to the sib mixer, select Aria in the slot and set a channel number. Then I open the Aria interface, set the channel to match the Sib mixer channel and choose an instrument to load into the slot. I set up each staff this way with the instruments I want to use..."

    I haven't had trouble getting Aria to be an option in Sib, it was just a matter of placing a copy of the .dll file in Sib's VST folder, but I haven't been able to get the instruments available in the way you've described. Last night I loaded the sounds I wanted, but they still weren't available in Sib - I had to go to the Playback Devices dialogue and set things up. Maybe this is different in Sib 7 than Sib 5, which I use.

    My problem still is that while I can get all other instruments set up, I can't get the drums to be recognized in the same way.

    I know you're saying that you use a regular non-percussion track so Sib will play any percussion you want, but that doesn't result in standard percussion notation. If someone is using Sib primarily to make printed scores, the drum part needs to be notated in a way that drummers understand.

    And that's one of your issues, Jerome. You described a more convoluted way of getting Sib to play the JABB drums - but you said you're giving these print outs to a drummer. I don't think that's satisfactory at all to have him trying to read something with sharps and flats, deciphering the notes with a drum note chart. You need the drums to be in standard notation - As Yhoh outlined, snare in the third space, kick on the first space etc - That's the only proper, accepted way for drums to be notated.

    That's why I've just put up with whatever sounds Sib wants to use - it's the print out that I'm focused on. For recordings of music I want other people to hear, I have to do that in Sonar.

    Jerome, I would suggest that you go back to a GM drum set up in Sib, even if you can't get it to trigger the GM JABB drums. You make the note "with brushes," and then there are standardized symbols for making note of things like when you want the snare to be swirling with the brush. The snare itself is still on the third space, there's just the note that a brush is being swirled - That's what a drummer will understand.

    And, Jerome, you said, "...I couldn't understand the part you've mentioned about the Instrument ID instead of instrument name, actually I didn't understand all this part:

    Randy: "When I give them names in the Playback Devices pop-up, under Program they are no longer listed as (unused) but now say (unknown)- then the Sound ID is listed on the right"


    Maybe this is different in Sib 7 - But in my Sib 5, if I just bring Aria in, that's only the first step. I can't just put the instruments I want in and then have them available. The instruments should be in a sound set of the sort Sib recognizes - but I don't think one's been written. So we have to go through the process of setting up a manual sound set.

    Here's a screen shot of what I was talking about. Until I make selections in the Sound ID section, the list on the right remains on (unused) - and no sound will be available for triggering in Sib. I've drawn a circle around the Sound ID menu with an arrow pointing to the instrument that's effecting. The jazz score for this sound set is behind - Sax, Piano, Bass, Drums. I used the default MIDI channel assignments as they come up with that Ensemble when loaded in ARIA.

    And, as I've said, the only problem is that when I get to the drums, and select the check box "General MIDI-compatible drum map," as it says to do in the Sib manual - it still says (unused) in the right hand list. It says GM Drum map - but it's not available for playing from my keyboard. Somehow, the notes are played when I insert notes by hand - but not all of them. And, hoping to avoid problems, it's one of the GM drum sets I loaded in JABB, because those sounds are triggered by the traditional GM notes - C1 is kick, C#1 is snare rim, D is snare etc.



    Randy

  8. #8

    Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    In the manual sound set screen, you need to choose a sound set (where it says none).
    The program dialogue box will then be activated with a list of available sounds to choose for the specific channel number. You then need to click the "apply" button at the bottom and you will be asked if you want to save the configuration. You can also choose a particular sound ID in the preferred sounds tab.

    From what I understand the manual sound sets are for making your own if there isn't one or you want to set up a specific configuration. At the moment we don't have a sound set for World Instruments but there should be one listed for GPO and JABB.

    If you want a standard drum notation for drummers to play from, you can do it by using the create an instrument menu in Sib (I have Sib 6).

    Choose All Instruments, then choose Drum Kit and Drum Set under family, then choose the set you want and add to the score. Set up Aria with the kit or sounds you want then notate the staff in standard drum notation.

    The "snare stim rolling sound" will play back correctly in the 3rd space if you change the note head to the 12th one in the note section of the properties menu in Sib. (the note head with a backwards slash)

    Concerning the "not allocated" showing up in the Sib mixer, if you uncheck "use manual sound set " in the manual sound set page it wont show up and you can set up the sounds as you want them. You can't change the channels though.
    I leave it check for me as I like to set up the channels in order to match the Aria panel settings.

    Hope I haven't made for more confusion with my ramblings. It works for me but the Sibelius percussion aspects are certainly challenging!
    yjoh

    Music... A Joy For Life.

  9. #9

    Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Hello again, Yjoh - This thread is great. Conclusions may still be a bit difficult to arrive at, but I'm having fun experimenting in Sib and trying to get things working better.

    I think it's very likely that I'm getting different results than you guys, Yjoh and Jerome, because I'm using Sib 5.2, while you're using Sib 7. That being said - Here are some replies, after experimenting more this morning:

    Quote Originally Posted by yjoh View Post
    In the manual sound set screen, you need to choose a sound set (where it says none).
    The program dialogue box will then be activated with a list of available sounds to choose for the specific channel number. You then need to click the "apply" button at the bottom and you will be asked if you want to save the configuration. You can also choose a particular sound ID in the preferred sounds tab.

    From what I understand the manual sound sets are for making your own if there isn't one or you want to set up a specific configuration. At the moment we don't have a sound set for World Instruments but there should be one listed for GPO and JABB.
    For Sib 5.2, there doesn't seem to be a Soundset for the Aria versions of GPO and JABB - only for the previous versions that worked in Kontakt. But I don't even have those, so when I go to choose a Soundset, as you've described, Yjoh, JABB isn't listed. That's why I set about putting together a test Manual Soundset.

    So using the Sound ID tab was the only way I could set up sounds. I chose the appropriate instruments to match what I had loaded in Aria. All of them work except the drums aren't right - I can trigger JABB drum notes with a mouse but not my keyboard. The other instruments I can play with my keyboard. The difference is visible in my screenshot - drums remain on "unused" instead of "unknown."

    But with the mouse I still can't trigger all the notes - Just the basic ones - Kick, Snare, Toms, Closed High Hat. Open hat and cymbals aren't triggered - none of the black key parts of the kit are triggered.
    Quote Originally Posted by yjoh View Post

    If you want a standard drum notation for drummers to play from, you can do it by using the create an instrument menu in Sib (I have Sib 6).

    Choose All Instruments, then choose Drum Kit and Drum Set under family, then choose the set you want and add to the score. Set up Aria with the kit or sounds you want then notate the staff in standard drum notation.
    I was doing my experiment using a Sib template for a jazz quartet. That included drums - seen in my screenshot. But I experimented by inserting another drum as in the way you describe - Adding instruments the way you describe is my usual way of setting up a score, so that it's customized.

    But the new drum I inserted had the same results. I could hook it up to Aria, but there were the same limitations of what notes could be triggered - and my keyboard still wouldn't trigger the JABB drums.
    Quote Originally Posted by yjoh View Post
    The "snare stim rolling sound" will play back correctly in the 3rd space if you change the note head to the 12th one in the note section of the properties menu in Sib. (the note head with a backwards slash)
    The note head indicating brush is what I was thinking of yesterday when I was replying to Jerome. At the start of the score, the text note should be added saying "with brushes" - and then the way to indicate special articulations is with different note heads, as you're saying.

    But I tried that - I changed a note on the third space that was triggering the regular (brushed) snare, but that made the note trigger the high tom! In fact, changing note heads on any space or line made notes trigger the high tom, D2. - odd.
    Quote Originally Posted by yjoh View Post
    Concerning the "not allocated" showing up in the Sib mixer, if you uncheck "use manual sound set " in the manual sound set page it wont show up and you can set up the sounds as you want them. You can't change the channels though.
    That doesn't work at all for me. I had my quartet set up semi-successfully, as I've explained - But if I went back to that window and unchecked "use manual sound set"--then no Aria/JABB instruments were available. Back in the program, that made all four instruments revert to MIDI Channel 1 on a GM piano. I couldn't select JABB instruments anymore, because they were no longer being recognized by Sib - The program has to have a soundset available to it, either already scripted, or manually set up, as we're describing here.

    Going back and checking "use manual sound set" brought back what I'd set up, logically enough.

    I looked online and there are JABB soundsets available for the old Kontakt version of both JABB and GPO. The newer soundsets available for Aria are for Sib 6 and 7. If I had a new version of Sib and these soundsets, then I'm sure things would work correctly.

    Jerome - make sure you have these current soundsets for JABB, and be sure you're using one of JABB's GM drum kits so you can use the right percussion staff and use standard notation that your drummer can read.

    So! - Nothing's changed for me this morning, same semi-successful results. At this point I do have to assume I've gone as far as I can on this with my older version of Sib.

    Thanks, Yjoh and Jerome!
    Randy

  10. #10

    Re: JABB3 with Sibelius 7 - how to produce snare stim rolling sound?

    Hello Randy & Jerome

    Randy, I didn't realize that the JABB sound set I am using was for Sib 6 or higher. I now know why you are trying to create a manual sound set. Sorry for the confusion.

    If you want to create a standard drum percussion staff with the instruments ,sounds, note head shapes you want etc, you can do this more easily (hopefully) in the Edit Instrument menu under the House Style menu.

    I have an image I wanted to include in this post but I can't work out how to do it. If I can figure it out I'll put it up. It shows the drum mapping dialogue where you can set it up as you like and use all the other sounds available i.e. the percussion sounds on the black keys etc.

    This will work for you Jerome but I'm not sure if it will work for you Randy.

    Good luck!
    yjoh

    Music... A Joy For Life.

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