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Topic: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

  1. #1

    Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    At the moment I am busy planning a high-quality sampling section of ORCHESTRAL BRASS.
    The only real library dedicated to orchestral brass, as far as I know, is Quantum Leap Brass. Actually it\'s only partly dedicated and has a lot of disadvantages, so what we need is a new, big & useful library 100% dedicated to the orchestral brass section!

    At the moment, planned instruments are:

    Trompet section (3 to 4 trompets)
    French horn section (4 horns)
    Trombone section (3 trombones)
    Tuba (1 to 2 tubas)

    Please share with me your 1st advise/suggestions/ideas!



  2. #2

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    I can tell you right now, if you don\'t also include solo brass on this disc-set, it won\'t be very popular.
    In fact it might serve you better to include three soloed trumpets rather than a section of 3-4 trumpets. Same goes for all the instruments.
    Give us solo and let us decide if we want 2 or 3 or 4 of any given instrument.

  3. #3

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    And I can tell you that without the solo brass, it will still be VERY popular - at least among me!! This sounds really good, I hope you have some good players to do it, so you can get brilliant performances. I think trumpets, fhorn and trombone can all be done much better than what is out there at the moment. Especially what I would be looking for are a ton of different expressions (many velocity layers, hand in bell, hand half in bell (if that is a playing style at all, etc) on the french horns. There are no french horns that sound really Hollywood-ish today. Huge horns, both the hand-in-bell with \'oooomph\' and the big, softer sound are lacking. Trumpets... well everybody have been asking for John Williams kind of trumpets - very precise, fff performance without vibrato for stabs - and just very bright and clear \'outbursts\'. Trombones... not so sure about what you could do with those. But generally I just think at least 3-4 velocity layers on everything (maybe 8 on the fhorns ) and lots of different expressions: legato with fast attacks, legato with softer attacks and such.

  4. #4

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    And oh.. to Marty: Putting 3 similar, or almost similar (or dissimilar, for that matter) trumpets/fhorns/whatever on top of eachother will never sound like a section....

  5. #5

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    mspruijt: I agree totally with Simon!! I don\'t think your libary NEEDS solo instruments. I myself am looking for a better ensemble brass library, and simon has nailed it in terms of what I want too: louder, brighter punchier brass that sounds huge, or at least bigger than most libraries out there.

    QL Brass comes close, don\'t get me wrong its an excellent library.

    My suggestion is this: pop in a couple of your favorite Film music soundtrack CDs and listen for that brass sound, listen for what the brass is doing and how superb it sounds. Then figure out how we might closer achieve that using samples.

    Like simon has suggested, it\'d be by way of large ensemble sections, swells (and PLEASE something longer than the short sfz and swells out there already (again QLBrass was good, but we could have more), crescendo and decrescendo, how about both in one sample (<<>>), huge bright stabs, maybe some rhtyms? maybe short runs (listen to some chase or fight scenes) etc.

    I also love it when \"p\" sustains are crossfaded via modwheel to \"ffffff\". I added a few extra fortissimos there because very very rarely do any samples seem to sound like the kind of fortissimo Simon and I are talking about.

    French Horns: how about just two more horns to make the ensemble six horns?



    [This message has been edited by Robert Kral (edited 04-11-2001).]

  6. #6

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    Please don\'t forget a big fat bass trombone! I also vote for both solo and ensemble playing, as well as an extensive collection of performance techniques, especially from the horns, e.g. stopped to unstopped notes w/ and w/o a gliss, a variety of stopped articulations, etc.


  7. #7

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    Thanks to all you guys for the useful replies. This is THE way to learn about the sample needs of the real, common user!

    BY ALL MEANS, LET US CONTINUE THIS FORUM TRHEAD and gather more and more info and ideas!

    I totally agree NOT to sample solo brass. I think there are simply enough well-done libraries for solo instruments, like the X-Sample series, which has some really playable solo samples.

    I also agree we should study and try to focus on the \"heavier\" film soundtracks (Zimmer, Williams) and decide which list of brass techniques, note lenghts and attack-speeds would be required to simulate let\'s say, the kind of heavy French horn melodies like in Gladiator, track 3 at 3\'00 or 4\'13. There\'s a great need of short brass, accented samples, longer than staccato, but shorter than portato. I\'m sure you all know what I mean.

    6 French horns hey? Well it isn\'t a standard number in a normal symphony orchestra, but we\'ll see. It really depends on the weight and strength of the 4 horns-samples!

    The bass trombone jdeborde mentioned sounds attractive too! It can give you much more body when playing loud passages.

    Just one note: let\'s not only focus on the heavy, full-blast Action movie sound, but ALSO on the need of more subtle, soft samples. French horns are beatiful to play soft, sensitive passages.

    As it\'s planned now, there will be programming for AKAI and GIGA. I am a Gigastudio user and I will do the Giga-format programming. I\'ll surely use the modulation wheel to crossfade betweem soft and loud and perhaps the release trigger function from version 2.0 is interesting for adding realistic note ends.

    I\'ll wait for some more replies and post mine along the way!

    Thanks again,

    Maarten Spruijt
    ( http://mspruijt.ontheweb.nl )

  8. #8

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    6 french horns is what John Williams use. He use 4 trumpets, 4 trombones and 6 french horns.

    It would be great to have pp/p staccato samples in the french horns to be used with soft melodies.

    And I have never heard the \"darth vader\" trombone sound in any library yet...Maybe this is the time?


    [This message has been edited by Ewen (edited 04-11-2001).]

  9. #9

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    I just say: Do NOT forget Pop/Rock/Jazz!!!


  10. #10

    Re: Planning ORCHESTRAL BRASS SECTION sample recording

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by OH:
    I just say: Do NOT forget Pop/Rock/Jazz!!!




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