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Topic: RMX or Logic Bug ?

  1. #1

    RMX or Logic Bug ?

    I found a strange behavior or (bug) using the RMX x.9 software update with Logic 9 when import (or open old Logic project (L8), where there is an RMX instance which use a Midi Learn Template CC# map ( in my case that map is huge containing 648 parameters for the Mixer, All Main Groups of the all 8 parts plus their Chaos designers ). In this case when import this learn template or open the project in L9 with say RMX 1.9.3f then Logic hangs and I must force quit it.
    I did several tests to find out what causes that - RMX or Logic? Here are a few examples of the tests:

    • I open the Logic project in Logic 8 with same RMX v.1.9.3f and it works perfect - no problems unless that the new RMX v.1.9.3f GUI reacts much slower when I bang a huge amount of CC# messages in comparison I did with RMX versions x1.8. After I close the native RMX GUI (v.1.9.3f) it seems it takes lots of system resources for a while ( it works well ) but it does not load the CC# messages properly ( say I bang more then 100 CC# to achieve a scene "snapshot automation" for some reason). It was not a problem in RMX v.1.8.x.

    • In the second scenario I change/replace the RMX component to go back to the old RMX v.1.8.x for example. The Midi Learn Template works as charm both in Logic 8 and Logic 9 - no problems with the import or reading the template as well very good and fast RMX midi response.

    • In the third scenario I'm trying to test the RMX Midi Learn Template creation and see what cause this strange behavior. Here I "Clear All" of the default RMX template using RMX v.1.9.3f again and create 64 CC# learn parameters for the Mixer and 73 for the Part one incl the Edit page and the Chaos designer. I save the template (load) it back and it works. After that I want to test if RMX has some CC# parameter midi learn "about" limitation which can cause the problem when you load a template of 648 parameters regarding Logic 9. Voala - the moment I try to Clone Part One midi map to parts 2-8 the Logic hangs.
    Any ideas. By the way here is the RMX Midi Learn Template so you can try to load into RMX v.1.9 x with Logic 9 x. I do not have tested in L9.1 cause I did not updated to 64 bit OS yet.

    The problem RMX template - Download

  2. #2

    Re: RMX or Logic Bug ?

    Logic 9 added the ability to update the automation menu to show the currently automatable parameters in a plugin. A change was made in Stylus RMX 1.9 to take advantage of this feature. When you have 648 midi learned parameters, Logic updates that menu 648 times, in case you are enabling the parameter for automation (midi learn and automation share the same mechanism). As a result, it will take a minute or so to load that template.

    How on earth do you use that template? :-). Do you have 648 midi controls memorized, and know what each one controls?

    - Glenn

  3. #3

    Re: RMX or Logic Bug ?

    As a result, it will take a minute or so to load that template.
    Thanks for the input Glenn0 !
    I did not had an idea to wait so long time but it seems that you are right. It takes 2-3 min or so on the different systems which must be something like an RMX bug about reading/showing the Logic Track Automation parameter names.
    But NOTE ! The Logic Track Automation is based on so called "Fader messages" i.e it is the the new "Enable Host Automation" ID parameters which is quite different from the standard CC# Automation. In this sense the Midi Learn Template I'm talking about is in CC# only, so Logic must not has to try to read any Host Automation IDs ( and try to convert to Track Automation parameter names cause it is a CC# map and Logic or any DAW can not show any names regarding that ) !
    Even that if the Template was in Host Autom. IDs - one minute or two min waiting to load or read names seems to be a funny update... Honestly it must be fixed.
    One more thing... In the past I did some experiments with the new RMX host automation and found out that if you try to "learn" enable host automation for more than 127 parameters in Logic then the RMX can not create Logic fader messages over 127 which seems to be a limitation for such plugin which supports too many parameters. As an example more and more third party plugins support this "14byte" fader automation messages regarding Logic.

  4. #4

    Re: RMX or Logic Bug ?

    Ok :-).

    But, it sounds like you're making things way too complicated for yourself. The flexible assignment system in RMX is designed to relieve you of the need to perform task of setting up templates beforehand. Instead, whenever you feel the need to automate a parameter in a session, project, or stage performance, do it at that time. There is no need to create one template that enables every parameter you might want to automate for the rest of your life :-).

    - Glenn

  5. #5

    Re: RMX or Logic Bug ?

    But, it sounds like you're making things way too complicated for yourself.
    I think I do not. RMX as any other plugin must have fast respond and no limitation about the number of the CC assignments. As an example why is Clone Part 1 assignments ? Doing that it is quite clear that the number of the Controller assignments will increase totally. Can you imagine a live play situation. There is no time to use your mouse and load different "small" maps or wait 1-2 min Logic to read the names i.e to load the bigger template. It is a controller assignment document and must loads less then a second ( as it does in RMX v.1.8x for example ). My map is just standard - 8 parts Main Gropes, and the Mixer. Lets say I have presets in my external controller which mach these assignments so when change the preset you operate instantly for a live play or what else. I can give lots of scenarios why it must work as expected. The Midi Template maps must be fixed totally - I did not make a list of other Template Maps strange behavior or bugs, but as far as I remember a found a few more ( I think host ID assignments ) in the new updates as well.

  6. #6

    Re: RMX or Logic Bug ?

    Right, but I'm saying that trying to remember 648 midi learn assignments on your controller...well it seems like you're making things hard for yourself. But, I understand your point and we'll look into it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tangra View Post
    I did not make a list of other Template Maps strange behavior or bugs, but as far as I remember a found a few more ( I think host ID assignments ) in the new updates as well.
    If you believe you've discovered any bugs in RMX, please contact tech support with the details: support.spectrasonics.net

    - Glenn

  7. #7

    Re: RMX or Logic Bug ?

    Thanks Glenn.
    We are almost out of the main topic - have a look at your PM box...

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