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Topic: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

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  1. #1

    Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    Since I'm not hearing back from Worra via email , I'm posting this here..

    Here’s the thing: I love the sound of the Black Grand, Close perspective, but when I play e.g. Black Grand Close 1 K2.nki, it sounds artificial if you pedal up while at the same time striking new keys. I hear what seems to me like too loud release samples.. The ambient and medium ambient perspectives don’t seem to have this problem. I have the latest Kontakt 2 update. Does anyone know how this can be fixed?

    Thanks!

  2. #2

    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    I don't have the black grand, neither K2.

    But I use EW samples, which have a kompakt player with them (close to Kontakt).

    I know from that fact that if you click on edit on the left side, and unclick group edit, you can change the volume of the release trails.

    don't even know if it's worth a try really... but jus tthourhg I'd tell you.

  3. #3

    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    maybe one of these will help?

    rsp
    richard sven
    sound sculptist
    ------------------
    Nuendo 4.3 | Intel DP35DP : Intel Quad Core QX 6700 : 4GB RAM | Windows XP Pro SP3 | Lynx Two C | Midisport 2x2 | 2xUAD-1, UAD-2 Quad |

    Cubase 4.5.2 | MacBookPro 2.16 Ghz | 10.6.3 | 2GB | TC Konnekt 8

  4. #4

    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandarin Man
    Since I'm not hearing back from Worra via email , I'm posting this here..

    Here’s the thing: I love the sound of the Black Grand, Close perspective, but when I play e.g. Black Grand Close 1 K2.nki, it sounds artificial if you pedal up while at the same time striking new keys. I hear what seems to me like too loud release samples.. The ambient and medium ambient perspectives don’t seem to have this problem. I have the latest Kontakt 2 update. Does anyone know how this can be fixed?

    Thanks!
    I have encountered this as well, I *believe* (actually read this somewhere, probably on this forum) it is a bug in K2 which causes the note-offs of all the keys that were held with the pedal to sound on pedal up, thus resulting in an unnaturally loud release sound.

    My work around for the time being is to just turn down the release samples considerably...fortunately this is easily done by simply pushing up the mod wheel (which controls the volume of the release samples...). Of course you could even edit this after the fact and just lower the releases where necessary...

    matto

  5. #5

    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    I'm already using the latest updates. Strangely enough the ambient and medium ambient perspective instruments don't seem to have this problem. Or maybe it's less noticeable with these..

    Thanks for the tip, Matto.

  6. #6

    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandarin Man
    Here’s the thing: I love the sound of the Black Grand, Close perspective, but when I play e.g. Black Grand Close 1 K2.nki, it sounds artificial if you pedal up while at the same time striking new keys. I hear what seems to me like too loud release samples.. The ambient and medium ambient perspectives don’t seem to have this problem. I have the latest Kontakt 2 update. Does anyone know how this can be fixed?
    This is a known bug of Kontakt 2.1.1, it's not Worra's fault. When you play the same note several times while the sustain is held down, several release samples are played when you release the pedal. The wanted behavior is to play just one release sample (as did previous versions of Kontakt).

    You can fix this by downgrading Kontakt or using one of sevaral KSP scripts written for this issue. Here's my version:
    http://www-lehre.informatik.uni-osnabrueck.de/~mhalbrue/Kontakt/Release%20Mask.nkp

    Greetings
    Marc

  7. #7

    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    Quote Originally Posted by Mahal
    You can fix this by downgrading Kontakt or using one of sevaral KSP scripts written for this issue. Here's my version:
    http://www-lehre.informatik.uni-osnabrueck.de/~mhalbrue/Kontakt/Release%20Mask.nkp

    Greetings
    Marc
    Hey thanks Marc!!

  8. #8

    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    Quote Originally Posted by Mahal
    This is a known bug of Kontakt 2.1.1, it's not Worra's fault. When you play the same note several times while the sustain is held down, several release samples are played when you release the pedal. The wanted behavior is to play just one release sample (as did previous versions of Kontakt).

    You can fix this by downgrading Kontakt or using one of sevaral KSP scripts written for this issue. Here's my version:
    http://www-lehre.informatik.uni-osnabrueck.de/~mhalbrue/Kontakt/Release%20Mask.nkp

    Greetings
    Marc
    Marc, I saved your script in K2's preset folder, I loaded up the Black Grand nki, opened the script editor, opened the Release Mask script in the first slot, but the problem is still there. Am I doing something wrong?

    Also, what exactly happens if you deactivate the Release Trigger button? Because if I deactivate it, I still hear release samples, although it reduces the problem..

    Thanks,
    Roy

  9. #9

    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandarin Man
    Am I doing something wrong?
    No, you did everything right. The script stops the accumulation of release samples, but does not stop release samples "as such".

    I'm not sure whether this is still a Kontakt problem, or whether it's a matter of personal taste. Sometimes I've the impression that developers set the volume of releases rather high to show that they're there. If you have the time, try to downgrade Kontakt and see if the problem persists.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandarin Man
    Also, what exactly happens if you deactivate the Release Trigger button? Because if I deactivate it, I still hear release samples, although it reduces the problem.
    When you deactivate this button, you transform the release samples to "ordinary" samples that are played when you press a key.
    You probably didn't deactivate "Release Trigger" for all groups. You could try to lower the volume of the release group(s) instead.

    Hope this helps
    Marc
    http://kurzfiler.sourceforge.net

  10. #10
    Senior Member
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    Re: Black Grand close perspective artifacts

    Quote Originally Posted by Mahal
    Sometimes I've the impression that developers set the volume of releases rather high to show that they're there.
    I have the same feeling...

    Here is some tricks you can use too :

    1/ Lower the release group volume as Marc suggest, but also lower the release trigger time (say by 1/4 - 1/3 or more)

    2/ Simply suppress release sample trigger for pedal down groups : the easiest way to do this (without scripts) is to move releases samples into a specific instrument (this also gives you a more convenient way to adjust release volume level to your taste)


    The greather benefit of release sound is to add "bite" to staccato play. Setting a separate release instrument -PU only- with short release time is for me a good solution.

    Another way is to get rid of release samples and use patches with convolution PU resonance (there's no such impulse for black grand, but other impulse can work well, with some tweaking)

    Best,
    Laurent.

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