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Topic: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

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  1. #1

    Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    I'm trying to use GPO in Kontakt 2.1 with both Finale (for final printouts) and Digital Performer (for initial sketching, and more easily edited audio demos.)

    The keyswitches in Finale don't seem to appear in exported standard MIDI files, so transferring between the two programs can be complicated.

    Has anyone found a solution to this?

    Thanks.
    Tom Flaherty
    http://tomflahertymusic.com
    Finale 2006d, Mac 2GHz Dual G5, 4 GB RAM, 10,000 RPM Western Digital drive for library. GPO, EWQLSO, Garritan JBBL, Kontakt 2.1, DP 4.61, Digi 002.

  2. #2

    Re: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    The KeySwitches are there, when I export from Finale. But, they are very tiny. You can easily miss them in a Piano Roll. Doesn't DP have something like Sonar's Event List? Easier to spot them here.

    Come to think of it, I have not yet tried exporting when GPO is loaded into Kontakt 2. Maybe if you set Human Playback Preferences | Activate GPO Support to Auto Detect it won't detect, that you use GPO, when it is loaded into K2. Try Always instead.

  3. #3

    Re: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    Thanks, Nickie. Activate GPO Support "Always" did the trick.

    It's curious that when the MIDI file is opened in DP, each keyswitched instrument opens with 2 tracks (with independent MIDI chennels), one with the "real" notes, one with the keyswitch notes. Makes me wonder about the best way to transfer the file back to Finale.

    Do you regularly move files between Finale and Sonar?
    Tom Flaherty
    http://tomflahertymusic.com
    Finale 2006d, Mac 2GHz Dual G5, 4 GB RAM, 10,000 RPM Western Digital drive for library. GPO, EWQLSO, Garritan JBBL, Kontakt 2.1, DP 4.61, Digi 002.

  4. #4

    Re: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    I move them from Finale to Sonar, not the other way. If you want to go from DP to Finale, you may have to merge the keyswitch track with the regular track in DP before saving (or in Finale after opening)

  5. #5

    Re: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    Thanks. That seems sensible.

    Does anyone know a way to accomplish the key switching action (changing arco to pizz samples, for instance) with a standard midi message rather than a note?

    This whole arrangement of accomplishing what used to be a patch change with a note really complicates moving between notation and sequencing programs, and must complicate the lives of the programmers too. It would be great if there were a standard way to do this without involving actual notes.
    Tom Flaherty
    http://tomflahertymusic.com
    Finale 2006d, Mac 2GHz Dual G5, 4 GB RAM, 10,000 RPM Western Digital drive for library. GPO, EWQLSO, Garritan JBBL, Kontakt 2.1, DP 4.61, Digi 002.

  6. #6

    Re: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    Quote Originally Posted by TomFlaherty
    Thanks. That seems sensible.

    Does anyone know a way to accomplish the key switching action (changing arco to pizz samples, for instance) with a standard midi message rather than a note?

    This whole arrangement of accomplishing what used to be a patch change with a note really complicates moving between notation and sequencing programs, and must complicate the lives of the programmers too. It would be great if there were a standard way to do this without involving actual notes.
    I know that Overture 4 does that. You put "pizz" and it will trigger the keyswitch for you. I think that Finale 2006 does that too. (as long as you are using the Finale edition GPO.)

    I am a Finale 2004 user, so I use Garritan Studio with it. I don't really use the KS instruments unless I know I am going to be using ALL the articulations. The KS instruments load the same amount of RAM that it would take to load all the individual ones together. So, unless you are playing in real time, there is no advantage to using the KS instruments
    Not using the KS instruments allows for text expression patch changes. For me, "Pizz" changes that to a Pizz patch, and arco changes it back. Etc. I created those expressions and load them with each new document i am working on.

    But, you are right in that if you are moving this to a sequencer, you WOULD want the KS patches.
    I don't see an easy solution.

    Jerry
    MacBook Pro Intel Core 2 Duo 2.5ghz 4GB Ram OSX 10.5.8
    Korg TritonLe & MAudio Oxygen 8
    T3, Logic 9, DP7, K2, GPO4, Strad, Gofriller, C&MB, Finale 2010

    My Website!
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  7. #7

    Re: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    I know that Overture 4 does that. You put "pizz" and it will trigger the keyswitch for you. I think that Finale 2006 does that too. (as long as you are using the Finale edition GPO.)
    Finale 2006 does the same with full GPO. It essentially adds a hidden Keyswitch note to the MIDI stream. I believe a KeySwitch note is the only way you can trigger a keyswitch. And this KeySwitch note will have to be in an exported MIDI file for the keyswitch action to be ported to another application.

    So, unless you are playing in real time, there is no advantage to using the KS instruments
    In Finale 2006 the setup is easier with KS instruments. You don't have to deal with multiple channels for each instrument. And you don't have to edit your expressions, if the channel configuration changes.

  8. #8

    Re: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    Is the main advantage to keyswitching at the setup stage?

    Is there a CPU advantage to using keyswitching rather than instrument banks with patch changes?
    Tom Flaherty
    http://tomflahertymusic.com
    Finale 2006d, Mac 2GHz Dual G5, 4 GB RAM, 10,000 RPM Western Digital drive for library. GPO, EWQLSO, Garritan JBBL, Kontakt 2.1, DP 4.61, Digi 002.

  9. #9

    Re: Key switching saved in standard MIDI file?

    1. I guess so. Plus you don't need to occupy as many slots in the Kontakt Players. Important if you load an entire orchestra, since you can max. load 64 instruments with the Kontakt Player.

    2. I don't know.

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