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Topic: ivory velocity

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  1. #1

    ivory velocity

    Hi - after my previous post about velocity reponse and also trying demos of various piano samples, I bought Ivory 1.5 for pc.

    I've been tryiong to sort out getting the velocity curve right for my Yamaha p80 and the steinway D and although I'm nearly there with it I'm still miles off with the bose and the C7.

    What I'm finding (as with the white grand) is that even at a velocity value of one (I created it with the pencil tool in the midi editor of SX) the resulting sound does not sound to me like a pp piano sample. Even if I play with the dynamic range knob and the curves to actually get the sound to have a lower SPL, the actual sample still sounds like it's one of a piano key being hit harder. Does that make sense?

    The Steinway seems to have a warm sound when triggered softly and it speaks as if the key has been pressed at low velocity. The other samples just aren't right for me.

    Can anyone else share a similar experience?

    I've never played a C7 but I have just finisihed a big recording session of a new russian peice for solo piano using a bose SE imperial and I spent a fair bit of time with the tech guy exploring pianissimo sounds (as these featured a lot in the piece.)

    At the moment I don't feel the samples used in ivory are really that close ...

    Any thoughts greatly appreciated

  2. #2

    Re: ivory velocity

    Quote Originally Posted by mozart999uk
    Hi - after my previous post about velocity reponse and also trying demos of various piano samples, I bought Ivory 1.5 for pc.

    I've been tryiong to sort out getting the velocity curve right for my Yamaha p80 and the steinway D and although I'm nearly there with it I'm still miles off with the bose and the C7.

    What I'm finding (as with the white grand) is that even at a velocity value of one (I created it with the pencil tool in the midi editor of SX) the resulting sound does not sound to me like a pp piano sample. Even if I play with the dynamic range knob and the curves to actually get the sound to have a lower SPL, the actual sample still sounds like it's one of a piano key being hit harder. Does that make sense?

    The Steinway seems to have a warm sound when triggered softly and it speaks as if the key has been pressed at low velocity. The other samples just aren't right for me.

    Can anyone else share a similar experience?

    I've never played a C7 but I have just finisihed a big recording session of a new russian peice for solo piano using a bose SE imperial and I spent a fair bit of time with the tech guy exploring pianissimo sounds (as these featured a lot in the piece.)

    At the moment I don't feel the samples used in ivory are really that close ...

    Any thoughts greatly appreciated
    Download the TBO playable demo, (2 full octaves and all the C's
    It has 31 velocity samples/recorded note ranging from blistering FF to soft pp
    You can download it here: http://www.sampletekk.com/products.php?cat=32

    Try it out and let me know what you think!
    Worra
    SampleTekk

    Arf, arf, arf...

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Paris, France
    Posts
    310

    Re: ivory velocity

    You're right mozart, pp-ppp range is usually not what sampled pianos do the best. It's not only a matter of samples : midi keyboard are also less acurate in this range. Take a real piano : when you depress very gently a key, you get no sound at all, because hammers don't even touch the strings. It's usually a good tweak to neutralize the velo=1 to actually get no sound.

    About the samples : From a sample sound perspective only, Ivory steinway probably has the sweatest ppp sound, it's just like if you can "feel" the soft hammer's felt gently touching the strings. So it's quite natural that this one is your favorite for that matter.
    Ivory C7 is a bit overproduced for pop sound. TBO is way better, and as worra says, the extra layers sampling gives you a real good (and unique) control over ppp nuances.

    A trick to artificially "correct" the ppp timbre is to use lowpass filtering for lower velocities. It's not a panacea, but it can ease your play if the ppp samples sound to bright. It's doesn't much change the "hit strengh sense" anyway.

  4. #4

    Re: ivory velocity

    Thanks for replies guys.

    Worra - yep I'd thought about the TBO - my only problem was that I am running Kontakt 1 and when I tried the white and black grand demo I had a similar problem. I tried to tweak things but I don't find Konakt the most intuitive for doing that. Maybe if I had GS3.......

    Laurent - thanks for the tip with the low pass. Might give that a go with Cubase. Shame I can't do that from within Ivory....

    I do like the Steinway though..,. the sound is very nice and Ivory is very efficient!

    I did try the Steinberg Grand 2 and found the playability absolutely superb but I just didn't really rate the sound. Also it was very heavy on CPU....

  5. #5

    Re: ivory velocity

    Quote Originally Posted by mozart999uk
    Hi - after my previous post about velocity reponse and also trying demos of various piano samples, I bought Ivory 1.5 for pc.

    I've been tryiong to sort out getting the velocity curve right for my Yamaha p80 and the steinway D and although I'm nearly there with it I'm still miles off with the bose and the C7.

    What I'm finding (as with the white grand) is that even at a velocity value of one (I created it with the pencil tool in the midi editor of SX) the resulting sound does not sound to me like a pp piano sample. Even if I play with the dynamic range knob and the curves to actually get the sound to have a lower SPL, the actual sample still sounds like it's one of a piano key being hit harder. Does that make sense?


    At the moment I don't feel the samples used in ivory are really that close ...

    Any thoughts greatly appreciated

    Here are 2 things to try if you haven't already.
    Use the "level II" versions of the sample sets.
    Set a min velocity of about 10, in addition to making the curve lean towards the softer samples.

  6. #6

    Re: ivory velocity

    Wasn't there a discussion about 2 years ago about problems with the P-80's velocity response? I think soomeone found that it couldn't accurately register very low or very high velocities. You might do a search for P-80 and P80.

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