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Topic: Ensemble building question

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  1. #1

    Ensemble building question

    I am very impressed by how GPO deals with layering of multiple instances of the same instrument.. it's nice to have 2 flutes play in unison and SOUND like 2 flutes.

    however, I'm wondering about something.
    I've made a few files of some of my music using the layering technique, as described in the ensemble building tutorial. But that's all very nice when you're using strings that don't require switching back and forth from arco to pizz.... what about for those pieces that require frequent changes from arco to pizz? do I have to use twice as many channels as I normally would simply to get access to pizz and arco?

    the example I have in mind is a piece for string orchestra.
    if I use 22 solo strings the arco sections sound wonderful... except there aren't 22 solo string samples that have KS capability. does this eman I need to fill out those without KS capability with extra samples of pizz?

    One instrument I can identify easly with this problem is the contrabass. there's only one single KS solo contrabass. So to have 2 solo basses I'd actualy have to load 3 samples - 1 KS bass, 1 arco solo bass, and 1 pizz solo bass?

    or can I simply load multiple instances of the same KS sample and use all those solos layered?

  2. #2

    Re: Ensemble building question

    Beware of unisons! They can create phasing, when you use multiple instances of the same samples. And the arco and pizz solo's are contained in the KS solo's. And the "plr" instruments are build from the same samples as the solo's. For unisons without any risk of phasing you should only use the "plr" instruments. So to answer your question about the contrabass, you can create a safe section of 3 bass "plr" instruments and 1 pizz bass (the solo).

  3. #3

    Re: Ensemble building question

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickie Fønshauge
    Beware of unisons! They can create phasing, when you use multiple instances of the same samples. And the arco and pizz solo's are contained in the KS solo's. And the "plr" instruments are build from the same samples as the solo's. For unisons without any risk of phasing you should only use the "plr" instruments.
    yes I was aware of this. I had already assumed that layering the same sample was not a good idea.
    but how does one build a string ensemble when there are so few KS instruments?
    for each non-KS instrument it would mean having to load 2 instruments? one arco and one pizz?
    so to have 4 solo violins in a section, I'd load the 3 KS solos, plus one solo string arco, and another solo string pizz?

  4. #4

    Re: Ensemble building question

    No, you can not use the solo string arco and pizz (f.ex. Violin 1 arco & pizz) together with the same instruments KS version (f.ex. Violin 1 KS). If you use all 3 Violin solo KS instruments, there are no more solo violins to use.

    What you can do is forget the KS instruments, and use the old layer technique: layer 1 all solo "plr" instruments and layer 2 the pizz instrument(s). I think this ensemble building technique was really deviced for sequencers.

  5. #5

    Re: Ensemble building question

    What I do is this:

    Load three slots of, say, violin 1 KS solo. On the first slot, in the Kontakt player, use the transpose knob to transpose it up 1 semitone. Leave the second one alone, and transpose the third patch down 1 semitone. In your sequencer's MIDI track, transpose the first vioiln down 1 semitone, leave the second alone, and transpose the third violin up 1 semitone.

    This way, you can have all three violins in unison doing arco, pizz, or whatever without phasing. This is becuase the Kontakt transposer knob stretches the audio, while the sequencer's transposer transposes MIDI. And since the solo instruments are sampled chromaticly there will be no phasing.

    However, you must take into consideration that the KS keys have been transposed as well.

    With this technique you can even go as far as having five patches of one isntrument, but after transposing the instruemnts up or down 2 semitones the vibrato speeds are all over the place.


    -Chris

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