• Register
  • Help
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Topic: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

Share/Bookmark
  1. #1

    Thumbs up Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    Until the JABB update, I basically just used JABB with DP4.6 for rendering. My CPU maxed out with a full big band and while I could mute parts, and do other workarounds, I decided to notate in Finale without much playback at all and without JABB loaded. (Incidentally...no problems like this with GPO and Finale...that has worked for me just fine all along...JABB is just more RAM intensive...particularly the rhythm section). Then take the completed score and render in DP4.6 (which KICKS by the way...).

    Until JABB was updated and NOW.....

    (This relates to Finale 2006c and DP4.6 or another DAW)

    I have discovered that in Finale 2006c you can load the lite version of a full big band without any problem. Then when you go to the rendering stage in a DAW (if you take this next, IMO important step, as notation programs offer too many limitations on playback) take your exported midi file and replace with the non-diet versions of the files. Then add controller info. Not in Finale.

    BUT WAIT.....THERE'S MORE!!!!!

    I have found, because of my workflow that the new version of JABB has yet another nice feature when used in Finale. While you lose the playback capabilities of tongue/slur, you can raise the polyphony of the brass to 4 or 5 (I haven't been able to do this with saxes for some reason - NOTE **** LATER AFTER A POSTING BY TOM AND ANOTHER TRY THIS WORKS FOR THE SAXES TOO....SEE HIS POST FURTHER DOWN....still a minor glitch in alto 2 that is being corrected) . This means you can play in multiple parts at once while notating. I like to use the explode music function a lot when scoring tuttis. In other words I like to put all 4 or 5 trumpet parts in the 1st part and then add all appropriate articulations and so on and then later, after playing back in JABB I explode the music into the correct staves with the mass mover tool. Voilá, you have all parts with their correct markings and if you like this way of working, it is a REAL time saver.

    Then once all notation is done (and as tech support at Finale likes to say "Remember, this isn't a sequencer" - despite the fact that it clearly has sequencer like traits), play your score into your DAW adding all the bells and whistles.

    Just thought I'd share this for those who haven't already been doing this and are saying....what's he so excited about?

    Paul
    Last edited by daerp@mac.com; 01-18-2006 at 07:22 AM. Reason: Mistake discovered
    Mac Pro 2X2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xenon, 10Gb 800 MHz DDR2 FB-DIMM, OS10.6.4, Finale 2011, Digital Performer 7.1, Altiverb 6, Yamaha S90, Built-in audio, GPO, JABB, Garritan Authorized Steinway (Pro), Reason 3, M-Audio Ozone, Giovani, Symphonic Choirs, Kontakt 2, Vienna Symphonic Library. Website:http://www.paulread.ca

  2. #2

    Re: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    Quote Originally Posted by daerp@mac.com
    While you lose the playback capabilities of tongue/slur, you can raise the polyphony of the brass (I haven't been able to do this with saxes for some reason) to 4 or 5.
    I just checked this and, with one exception, the saxes all responded fine to raising the polyphony. The one exception was Alto 2 Lite - it had a programming oversight. That will be fixed in the next update. The others should be OK. If not, give me more info please.

    Tom

  3. #3
    New Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Massachusettes
    Posts
    12

    Question Re: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    [QUOTE=daerp@mac.com]Until the JABB update, I basically just used JABB with DP4.6 for rendering. My CPU maxed out with a full big band and while I could mute parts, and do other workarounds, I decided to notate in Finale without much playback at all and without JABB loaded. (Incidentally...no problems like this with GPO and Finale...that has worked for me just fine all along...JABB is just more RAM intensive...particularly the rhythm section). Then take the completed score and render in DP4.6 (which KICKS by the way...).

    Until JABB was updated and NOW.....

    (This relates to Finale 2006c and DP4.6 or another DAW)

    I have discovered that in Finale 2006c you can load the lite version of a full big band without any problem. Then when you go to the rendering stage in a DAW (if you take this next, IMO important step, as notation programs offer too many limitations on playback) take your exported midi file and replace with the non-diet versions of the files. Then add controller info. Not in Finale.


    Thanks Paul, this is very helpful!
    One question since I'm new to midi---
    Are you saying that you can somehow add controller info to the exported midi file within the DAW? First let's see if I'm understanding everything correctly since I haven't actually used my DAW to render parts yet---hoping try my first today.
    My understading is that, previous to the availability of the lite sounds in JABB, you advocated a rendering process that involved the playing in of parts one at a time directly into a DAW because that way you can achieve a more human feel and also eventually play back all instruments with out taxing the CPU because it's easier for the cpu to handle audio files than run virtual instruments. Am I right so far?
    This approach also allows one to be able to mix levels easily.
    What's not clear to me is how you can alter the midi data once it's in the DAW and what you gain by doing this because if you still have to play back the virtual instruments to audition your changes (before recording to audio) and particularly if they are now loaded with the full versions of the instruments, you will tax you CPU in the DAW just as much as, in not more, than you did in Finale.
    I'm probably missing something really obvious but I appreciate any feedback and info at your conveniece or anyone else who reads this. My DAW is Pro Tools by the way.
    Thanks
    Steve

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    NW Illinois
    Posts
    1,175

    Re: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    Quote Originally Posted by jazztao

    Thanks Paul, this is very helpful!
    One question since I'm new to midi---
    Are you saying that you can somehow add controller info to the exported midi file within the DAW? First let's see if I'm understanding everything correctly since I haven't actually used my DAW to render parts yet---hoping try my first today.
    My understading is that, previous to the availability of the lite sounds in JABB, you advocated a rendering process that involved the playing in of parts one at a time directly into a DAW because that way you can achieve a more human feel and also eventually play back all instruments with out taxing the CPU because it's easier for the cpu to handle audio files than run virtual instruments. Am I right so far?
    This approach also allows one to be able to mix levels easily.
    What's not clear to me is how you can alter the midi data once it's in the DAW and what you gain by doing this because if you still have to play back the virtual instruments to audition your changes (before recording to audio) and particularly if they are now loaded with the full versions of the instruments, you will tax you CPU in the DAW just as much as, in not more, than you did in Finale.
    I'm probably missing something really obvious but I appreciate any feedback and info at your conveniece or anyone else who reads this. My DAW is Pro Tools by the way.
    Thanks
    Steve
    Steve,

    You import a midi file into ProTools. Create an aux track in PT with JABB as a plugin. Make sure your midi track is bussed to that aux track. As you look at each midi track you can look at specific controller data. (i.e., modulation CC#1) You can edit that data and hear the resulting playback. Keep doing that until your processor starts to get taxed. At that point create an audio track and record from your aux track into the audio track. Now freeze you aux/mid track that you've just recorded. Using only an audio track for playback at this point frees up more CPU power to start adding more midi trakcs again. The only drawback is after you've rendered a track to audio, you can't edit the midi performance any more, you can just mix levels, add reverb now. If you need to edit a performance, unfreeze those tracks, do your fine tuning, then convert to audio again.

    It's really not as confusing as it sounds. Start with something small and simple, until you begin to understand your DAW. Then the sky's the limit.

    Jeff

  5. #5
    New Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Massachusettes
    Posts
    12

    Re: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Turner
    Steve,

    You import a midi file into ProTools. Create an aux track in PT with JABB as a plugin. Make sure your midi track is bussed to that aux track. As you look at each midi track you can look at specific controller data. (i.e., modulation CC#1) You can edit that data and hear the resulting playback. Keep doing that until your processor starts to get taxed. At that point create an audio track and record from your aux track into the audio track. Now freeze you aux/mid track that you've just recorded. Using only an audio track for playback at this point frees up more CPU power to start adding more midi trakcs again. The only drawback is after you've rendered a track to audio, you can't edit the midi performance any more, you can just mix levels, add reverb now. If you need to edit a performance, unfreeze those tracks, do your fine tuning, then convert to audio again.

    It's really not as confusing as it sounds. Start with something small and simple, until you begin to understand your DAW. Then the sky's the limit.

    Jeff

    Jeff
    Thanks very much for this. 1 more question---

    1) Can you clarify what you mean by "freeze"--do you mean mute the midi track so that playback is only heard from the audio track? If this is the case I assume the virtual instrument will not be triggered, and the cpu not taxed, if the midi track is muted or is "freezing" refering to some other command?
    thanks very much
    Steve

  6. #6

    Re: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    You are right, Tom. I just checked and the saxophones work as you described (all okay but alto 2). Don't know why it wouldn't work before. Probably some mistake on my part. I did just load in the new instruments text file though. Would that have changed the results?

    Thanks.Love the update.

    Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Hopkins
    I just checked this and, with one exception, the saxes all responded fine to raising the polyphony. The one exception was Alto 2 Lite - it had a programming oversight. That will be fixed in the next update. The others should be OK. If not, give me more info please.

    Tom
    Mac Pro 2X2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xenon, 10Gb 800 MHz DDR2 FB-DIMM, OS10.6.4, Finale 2011, Digital Performer 7.1, Altiverb 6, Yamaha S90, Built-in audio, GPO, JABB, Garritan Authorized Steinway (Pro), Reason 3, M-Audio Ozone, Giovani, Symphonic Choirs, Kontakt 2, Vienna Symphonic Library. Website:http://www.paulread.ca

  7. #7

    Re: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    Yes you can add controller data easily in your DAW. I am only familiar with DP, so Jeff's comments in this thread may be more relevant in your case. But in DP you can insert live through recording with the overdub feature and add pitchwheel, modwheel sustain or whatever your keyboard allows. I also use an easy method of typing in a controller value at the beginning of the track.. There is a reinsert command in DP that comes in handy when doing this over again in other parts or the same part. And there are other more sophisticated ways of adding in controller data using other editing modules within the program. You can "draw" in midi controller data with a special tool,etc..too much to mention in this message.

    You are right about my comment about the advantages of playing into DP (or...) with far more flexibiilty in how you phrase and place figures rhythmically.

    Once you have a track or a few tracks the way you want them. Record it to a separate audio track and disable the midi playback to lighten the load on your CPU. DPDan's posts are loaded with great info on this and you should check out his various postings (obviously related again to DP4.6)

    Once your MIDI data is in DP you can alter the data anyway you like. A sequencer will allow you to change nearly everything.

    Remember I am personally advocating notation and sequencing as two separate processes in achieving the best results in rendering your music.

    If your notation is completed (as is the case in many of the things I have done) and in paper form there is no need (unless you want to) to put the score into Finale. Just go straight to sequencing. Like most I have a unique workflow these days. For me it is a combination of paper and pencil (how I learned), then putting the music into finale to allow quick edits and so on - this step isn't necessary if you are only going to record into the sequencer - but if you want to print out parts for the band and get a nice score happening then it is essential. Am I being obtuse here? Hard to explain...it works well for me.

    Once the composition/arranging/orchestration is complete (paper or Finale) then the serious sequencing can begin if you want to do this. The other option is copy the parts and call the guys for a rehearsal).

    When sequencing, I often discover new things about my scoring along the way. I am a relentless tweaker. Always editing and editing. I once had a recording engineer say into my headphones between takes (Put down the pencil and step away from the score! LOL) But if you like some things that happen while sequencing then you can always go back to the notation files and rework them as well.

    Phew.......

    Paul

    PS What DAW and notation package are you using?


    Quote Originally Posted by jazztao
    Thanks Paul, this is very helpful!
    One question since I'm new to midi---
    Are you saying that you can somehow add controller info to the exported midi file within the DAW? First let's see if I'm understanding everything correctly since I haven't actually used my DAW to render parts yet---hoping try my first today.
    My understading is that, previous to the availability of the lite sounds in JABB, you advocated a rendering process that involved the playing in of parts one at a time directly into a DAW because that way you can achieve a more human feel and also eventually play back all instruments with out taxing the CPU because it's easier for the cpu to handle audio files than run virtual instruments. Am I right so far?
    This approach also allows one to be able to mix levels easily.
    What's not clear to me is how you can alter the midi data once it's in the DAW and what you gain by doing this because if you still have to play back the virtual instruments to audition your changes (before recording to audio) and particularly if they are now loaded with the full versions of the instruments, you will tax you CPU in the DAW just as much as, in not more, than you did in Finale.
    I'm probably missing something really obvious but I appreciate any feedback and info at your conveniece or anyone else who reads this. My DAW is Pro Tools by the way.
    Thanks
    Steve
    Mac Pro 2X2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xenon, 10Gb 800 MHz DDR2 FB-DIMM, OS10.6.4, Finale 2011, Digital Performer 7.1, Altiverb 6, Yamaha S90, Built-in audio, GPO, JABB, Garritan Authorized Steinway (Pro), Reason 3, M-Audio Ozone, Giovani, Symphonic Choirs, Kontakt 2, Vienna Symphonic Library. Website:http://www.paulread.ca

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    NW Illinois
    Posts
    1,175

    Re: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    Quote Originally Posted by jazztao
    Jeff
    Thanks very much for this. 1 more question---

    1) Can you clarify what you mean by "freeze"--do you mean mute the midi track so that playback is only heard from the audio track? If this is the case I assume the virtual instrument will not be triggered, and the cpu not taxed, if the midi track is muted or is "freezing" refering to some other command?
    thanks very much
    Steve
    It's been a while since I used this function, so the terminology might be wrong. Maybe in PT it's called "make tracks inactive"? It's not muting a track, it's where you select tracks (your midi & the correcsponding aux track) and choose "make tracks inactive" from the pull down menu. They'll then be grayed out and unavailable for editing. Only the audio track will be heard. Choose "make tracks active" to get back to them to do further editing.

    Jeff

  9. #9

    Re: Finale 2006c/JABB update - a time and cpu saver

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Turner
    It's been a while since I used this function, so the terminology might be wrong. Maybe in PT it's called "make tracks inactive"? It's not muting a track, it's where you select tracks (your midi & the correcsponding aux track) and choose "make tracks inactive" from the pull down menu. They'll then be grayed out and unavailable for editing. Only the audio track will be heard. Choose "make tracks active" to get back to them to do further editing.

    Jeff
    Hi Jeff
    I think that you are right on all counts, although we don't use the same software. In DP4.6 there is a freeze tracks function in the Audio memu (and to be honest I've never used it), but it amounts to a temporary bounce. It creates a new audio track that contains the original track complete with all real time effects. This mutes the original track automatically DPDan hipped me to the idea of bouncing completed tracks to audio and then disabling the midi track. I try to bounce once I have finished with all the instruments loaded into one GPO or JABB instance. But it sounds like I should be using the freeze tracks function since it allows for going back and forth between midi and audio more easily.

    Hope that this further comment helps. It was helpful for me to go back and check on this feature in DP4.6.

    Paul
    Mac Pro 2X2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xenon, 10Gb 800 MHz DDR2 FB-DIMM, OS10.6.4, Finale 2011, Digital Performer 7.1, Altiverb 6, Yamaha S90, Built-in audio, GPO, JABB, Garritan Authorized Steinway (Pro), Reason 3, M-Audio Ozone, Giovani, Symphonic Choirs, Kontakt 2, Vienna Symphonic Library. Website:http://www.paulread.ca

Go Back to forum

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •