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Topic: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

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  1. #1
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    Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Okay boys and girls, after having my initial version of this sucker recorded and programmed, my brand spanking new hard drive crashed (and I am one of those morons that doesn’t backup their work) so tomorrow I am going to slap some new strings on my Strat and rerecord it, but what I need from you is what YOU want to be in it (as in articulations and effects).

    As some might remember, I talked about releasing this thing when I first came here, and I have since gone through 4 different versions of it. The guitar will be HEAVILY distorted (on the distortion samples) and more suitable for heavy music, with all of the basic articulations (plucked, picked, power chords, palm muted, ect.) and whatever else I can think of plus whatever you guys suggest.

    Most importantly, it will be free. If anyone wants to offer up some server space for it or anything else, that would be awesome because right now I have no clue how to get this sucker out to you guys, as it might end up being over 1GB. I might end up expanding on the sample pool later on as well, depending on how much free time I have.

    With that said, I am not aiming to outdo any of the big guitar libs out right now, I am more focused on doing one that will have everything I need, and making a great sketch lib for those other composers who play guitar. Because of the distortion I will be using, certain articulations (like full chords and such) will not be in this because you can’t really hear them anyway. It will have 2 sample sets (for stereo), up/downpick (via round robin) and will use a combination of Mod Wheel and Key Switching to access the different samples on the fly, along with little scrapes and noises down below the guitar range for those who are using this as their final.

    Some of the big questions I have are: Do you want the clean samples unprocessed so that you can add whatever effects you want, or should I toss on chorus or whatever? Also, I remember kidsurf saying that he wanted to see a patch that already had the 2 guitars (panned hard left and right) on one patch, however with instrument stacking and Kontakt’s channel assignment, I don’t think it is all that necessary anymore, but it is up to you guys.

    As for format, I am probably going to send it out in Giga 2.5 because there is no cross fading so the transition shouldn’t be a problem to other formats.

    Anyhow, any questions / suggestions / rants / ect. ?

    Thanks,
    James W.G. Smith

    As a side note, I just want to thank all of the awesome devs on here for thier great work, your products have really opened alot of doors in my life, and I can never repay you enough. Many thanks to PMI, EWQL, Garritan, BelaD, G-Town, Project SAM, and all the rest of you guys. You RULE!!!

  2. #2
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    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Oh, I forgot that Giga 2.5 doesn't support RR... what format do you guys want this in?

    James

  3. #3

    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    James,
    thank you for your effort... we can't have too much guitar libraries

    Since you asked, I would suggest you to include also the clean sounds (without chorus, totally flat) so we'll be able to distort and process the sound how we like in Guitar Rig or Amplitube. It would increase enormously the flexibility of the library, so we can have a quality guitar sound even in those tracks where the heavy distortion you are planning isn't the best choice.

    What kind of articulations should you include? Unfortunately I am no guitar player so I can't say precisely, but we surely need something that, with the adequate amount of processing and adjustment, could make up a good "legato" lead line. Here I'm thinking about Santana's trademark riffs, with all his slides and bends.

    About the format, I believe the best would be Kontakt 2.0, so in the future someone could add (or yourself, if you dig the idea) some nice semi-automated articulation trickery via scripting.

    Thank you again for your effort, hope to see this up soon!

    --
    Claudio Tassitano
    The Soundwavers

  4. #4

    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Quote Originally Posted by James W.G. Smith
    Oh, I forgot that Giga 2.5 doesn't support RR... what format do you guys want this in?

    James
    Kontakt1 or Kontat2 would be great !
    Really looking foward to this. I hope you could really make this thing
    distorted

  5. #5

    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Quote Originally Posted by James W.G. Smith
    With that said, I am not aiming to outdo any of the big guitar libs out right now, I am more focused on doing one that will have everything I need, and making a great sketch lib for those other composers who play guitar.
    I really like that approach. I typically mock up brass tracks when I'm writing, and then record my real horns late in the process when the arrangement is set. Would be nice to have a similar facility for guitar parts.

    I'm on Kontakt 2 now (just got my update yesterday), so that would be my preference. Building for 1.5x would allow you to have the RR, but the scripting possibilities in v2 are totally compelling to me and will only manage to enhance the expressiveness of modern libraries.

    Distorted vs clean? Really it's up to you, as it's your baby. The only risk for distorted sounds to others using it as a tool is that they might come to think of your sound as "right" for the arrangment and not be able to reproduce it on their own rig! So I suppose ideally you would have distorted *and* clean sample sets, but that's double the work for a library you're not intending to get paid back for, and half a library you'll never use for your own purposes.

    So I say do what *you* want. Plenty of people will be happy with your decision either way.

    So far as articulations, I'd at least suggest creating a bunch of iterations of palm muting for the RR! That style of play will get you into "machine gun" territory very quickly! (of course, sometimes you want the machine gun sound, but then it's called "industrial rock" )

    Additional ideas: pick scrapes and slides, artificial harmonic picking, and fully-choked "chunk" (atonal) rhythm noises. But that might be overboard for just a tool: so easy for it to get out of control!

    - m
    Free MFX and other plugins: http://www.TenCrazy.com/
    Markleford's music: http://www.markleford.com/music/

  6. #6
    Senior Member Bruce A. Richardson's Avatar
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    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Quote Originally Posted by James W.G. Smith
    Oh, I forgot that Giga 2.5 doesn't support RR... what format do you guys want this in?

    James
    Giga 3 does, and supports a whole lot of other articulation features as well.

  7. #7

    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Split off a dry signal while recording. I don't mean clean... I mean literally a direct line from the guitar, so that you can realistically run it through any amp settings you want later. Then again, it's free, and that's extra work, so don't bother if you don't feel like it.

  8. #8
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    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Quote Originally Posted by Markleford
    Distorted vs clean? Really it's up to you, as it's your baby. The only risk for distorted sounds to others using it as a tool is that they might come to think of your sound as "right" for the arrangment and not be able to reproduce it on their own rig!
    Actually, that could end up being a problem. I'm going to be running through a Boss Pro SE-70 which was discontinued a while back, so it would be REALLY hard to get the same sound. But then again, it gives you another guitar sound that you would not have had in the first place.

    As for the "legato" thing, it would just take too long, and make this lib WAY too big. Trust me, for Santana style stuff, this will NOT be the lib to use. There are a ton of libs out there which would be much better suited for this kind of thing. Oh, and I don't have Kontakt 2 yet, so I think I'll just make 2 versions, one in 1.5 and one in Giga 3. If someone DOES want to convert it over to 2 so that you can script it or whatever, I am sure that wouldn't be too hard.

    "So far as articulations, I'd at least suggest creating a bunch of iterations of palm muting for the RR! That style of play will get you into "machine gun" territory very quickly! (of course, sometimes you want the machine gun sound, but then it's called "industrial rock" )"

    First I am going to try that approch that was slapped up here for short strings (dealing with streching) and see if that sounds halfway realistic, but if it doesn't I'll go ahead and record more samples (I know how bad this can sound).

    "Additional ideas: pick scrapes and slides, artificial harmonic picking, and fully-choked "chunk" (atonal) rhythm noises. But that might be overboard for just a tool: so easy for it to get out of control!"

    Pick scraps - for sure! Slides - I will have some effects slides but if you are saying slide to note that might be a bit tough (and a bit time consuming). Hopefully you can mimic it with the effect slides though . Artificial Harmonic - Honestly, I can't do these well. I'll have all the natural harmonics I can squeeze out but I never got the artificial harmonics down. I know, I suck . Fully-choked "chunk" (atonal) rhythm noises - I'm going to do some of these but exactly how many where you thinking of (and do you have any suggestions on some strange ones?)

    Thanks,
    James

  9. #9
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    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimi
    Split off a dry signal while recording. I don't mean clean... I mean literally a direct line from the guitar, so that you can realistically run it through any amp settings you want later. Then again, it's free, and that's extra work, so don't bother if you don't feel like it.
    Oh, none of this is going through an amp so when I say clean, I mean DIRECT clean. But again, I do need to stress, there are other libs out there which will be better for the process you are discribing, that are actually aimed to do that. The clean samples will most likely NOT have any chords, and be pretty cut and dry (plucked u/d, picked u/d, PM u/d, effects). Whenever I try to record chords clean they always sound REALLY fake in use for some weird reason.

  10. #10

    Re: Need Suggestions on a new Guitar Library

    Quote Originally Posted by James W.G. Smith
    Actually, that could end up being a problem. I'm going to be running through a Boss Pro SE-70 which was discontinued a while back, so it would be REALLY hard to get the same sound.
    In that case, make them distorted: I also use a SE-70 in my rig!

    (then again, different guitar going into it, unless you also have a Japanese Squier Strat from the early 90s? And a model 1 Whammy pedal, and a Boss RPS-10 backwards delay...)

    Slides - I will have some effects slides but if you are saying slide to note that might be a bit tough (and a bit time consuming).
    I just mean "effects" slides for before the guitar comes in after not playing or between verse/chorus changes. Y'know: 1-2-3-BOWWW! (slide down low E string)

    I'll have all the natural harmonics I can squeeze out but I never got the artificial harmonics down. I know, I suck
    Not to worry: I probably just use them too much myself!

    Fully-choked "chunk" (atonal) rhythm noises - I'm going to do some of these but exactly how many where you thinking of (and do you have any suggestions on some strange ones?)
    Perhaps like 8 or so?

    Anyway, don't go overboard. Stick to what you can use mostly: all else is just gravy for us!

    - m
    Free MFX and other plugins: http://www.TenCrazy.com/
    Markleford's music: http://www.markleford.com/music/

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