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Topic: Dual Instruments on one staff

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  1. #1

    Question Dual Instruments on one staff

    Hi guys,

    If I am using Sibelius, and I want two instruments to be on one staff (i.e. a "2 Oboes" staff), I'm a stuck with the Ens. patches? I'm not crazy about those, and would love to use the solo, or even the Plr patches.

    Thanks,
    MsP

  2. #2

    Re: Dual Instruments on one staff

    Hey Tom, one problem I've had is that when I do assign instruments to different layers in Finale, the notes in layers 2, 3 and 4 don't seem to be subject to Human Playback dynamic changes. The score will have a hairpin crescendo, but the mod wheel won't move, until I "tap" the modwheel with the mouse arrow, and then suddenly the sound will jump louder. Have you had any luck with this? It's really prevented me from using layers in Finale...

    Steve
    Steve Main
    stmain@aol.com
    www.stephenmain.com

  3. #3
    Senior Member rpearl's Avatar
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    Re: Dual Instruments on one staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Mattssound
    Hi guys,

    If I am using Sibelius, and I want two instruments to be on one staff (i.e. a "2 Oboes" staff), I'm a stuck with the Ens. patches? I'm not crazy about those, and would love to use the solo, or even the Plr patches.

    Thanks,
    MsP
    Matt,

    I believe you will have to add a staff for the second oboe (at least for playback). On oboe sample can only play one pitch at a time. This is what we call a dummy score. Really.

    R. Pearl

  4. #4

    Re: Dual Instruments on one staff

    Quote Originally Posted by stmain
    Hey Tom, one problem I've had is that when I do assign instruments to different layers in Finale, the notes in layers 2, 3 and 4 don't seem to be subject to Human Playback dynamic changes. The score will have a hairpin crescendo, but the mod wheel won't move, until I "tap" the modwheel with the mouse arrow, and then suddenly the sound will jump louder. Have you had any luck with this? It's really prevented me from using layers in Finale...

    Steve
    Make sure all layers are assigned to the same channel, since expressions can only affect one channel per staff (I assume you are using GPO).

  5. #5

    Re: Dual Instruments on one staff

    MsP,
    Sib doesn't support multiple voices on separate channels on one staff like some synths and other notation programs do (this is the best approach to divisi writing on a single staff.)

    The best you can do with Sib is to change the polyphony on the Solo Oboe patch in the Kontakt player to a higher value, say '4' (to account for overlaps/legato). The polyphony is specified in the small box on the right below the CPU USAGE box. It starts out as "0/1" for the solo oboe. Click down with the mouse over the right-hand digit ("1") and slide the mouse up to increase this value to 4, so that it looks like "0/4".
    Bill

  6. #6

    Re: Dual Instruments on one staff

    Okay, wait, we have some confusing advice (at least to my feeble brain!) being given here:

    I'm hearing that I should assign different layers to the same channel. But how can you have more than one instrument in one channel? Am I just missing something?
    Steve
    Steve Main
    stmain@aol.com
    www.stephenmain.com

  7. #7

    Re: Dual Instruments on one staff

    Quote Originally Posted by stmain
    Okay, wait, we have some confusing advice
    Hello from across the bay. Maybe the confusion comes from the fact that the original thread was referring to Sibelius, not Finale. I don't see how any references to Finale in this thread will help Mattssound with his original question.
    Bill

  8. #8

    Re: Dual Instruments on one staff

    In Sibelius 3, I put two oboe parts and two flutes on their respective staves and it works fine. I recall that I tried it with the solo patch and that didn't work, but that the PLA did. I have not used the Ens woodwind patches yet (new Sib user).

    For RAM usage economy (I'm not recording yet, just playing back) I only load one PLA patch per instrument. I don't think you can put two patches on a staff in Sibelius. I've arranged a piece that shifts back and forth between string ensemble in five parts and a solo string quintet, and I had to create ten staves to play it back.

  9. #9
    Senior Member rpearl's Avatar
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    Re: Dual Instruments on one staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Smith
    In Sibelius 3, I put two oboe parts and two flutes on their respective staves and it works fine. I recall that I tried it with the solo patch and that didn't work, but that the PLA did. I have not used the Ens woodwind patches yet (new Sib user).

    For RAM usage economy (I'm not recording yet, just playing back) I only load one PLA patch per instrument. I don't think you can put two patches on a staff in Sibelius. I've arranged a piece that shifts back and forth between string ensemble in five parts and a solo string quintet, and I had to create ten staves to play it back.
    Some of the confusion comes from what flute or oboe patch is being used: a solo flute can only deliver one pitch at a time; ensemble or section instruments can play several (up to 4?). Sibelius doesn't offer the "assign a layer/voice" option that Overture, and apparently Finale do.

    Matt, I may have mislead you with my reply above - I was thinking it was a solo patch. But, if you want some dynamic differences between two voices on the same staff, I'd advise placing one on another staff.

    Hope this helps.

    R. Pearl

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