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Topic: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

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  1. #1

    Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    I'm wondering if there is any way to emulate the effects of the soft pedal in GS3 on such products as the Old Lady / Emperor etc.

    I've done a quick search but can't find anything that could help me replicate what would happen. Anyone know of a method?

    Thanks Steve

  2. #2
    Senior Member Bruce A. Richardson's Avatar
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    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    If you were not doing it in real time, you could probably engage a filter via CC and an EQ insert of some kind. Perhaps you could even route a secondary pedal to this, and get a realtime experience...

    To date, I do not believe anyone has actually sampled this separately. I would surmise that the lack of mainstream controller methods makes it a rather unattractive idea to spend the time and resources in a situation where most end users would not be able to engage the samples. Even sustain/sostenuto pedaling is not supported in a way which is behaviorally emulative of the live playing experience (as I'm sure you're aware).

  3. #3

    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    Yeah, seems to be one of the missing links in piano emulation.

    I'm wondering if anything could be programed to use the GPulse technology. I'm pretty new to GS3, and most of my sample libraries are pianos.

    I'm sure I read that the kontakt2 samples manage to emulate this somehow. I know it has this new fangled scripting engine, but the logic behind what it is doing must apply in some way to GS3, or am I holding the wrong end of the stick?

    Thanks Steve

  4. #4

    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    Couldn't that simply be achieved by adding a keyswitch assigned to a MIDI pedal? Letting it switch to the "soft" version containing only the softer layers or by decreasing the size of the sample zones of the loud layers (for instance FFF 115-127 to 123-127).

  5. #5

    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    Quote Originally Posted by Herman Witkam
    Couldn't that simply be achieved by adding a keyswitch assigned to a MIDI pedal? Letting it switch to the "soft" version containing only the softer layers or by decreasing the size of the sample zones of the loud layers (for instance FFF 115-127 to 123-127).
    Yes, and maybe adding some filtering as well. But to do it correctly, you need to sample it separately. As I understand it, modern grands slide the hammers over to hit a subset of the strings.

    -JF

  6. #6

    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    Correct. This results in less harmonic content, possibly less vibrato. With the bass section with only string per note there is hardly any difference, but when the two strings per note and 3-string sets are played you have a completely different sound that is very hard to emulate. The vibrato that is the result of 3 strings (almost) singing in tune cannot be converted to the sound impression of 2 strings singing (almost) in tune, unless you can have some of the processing power of Melodyne applied in real-time to remove irregular vibrato patterns including their overtone series.
    However, the previous mentioned methods of applying a LP-filter in combination with an attenuation both connected to the appropriate midi cc# works in GS3 and can help to emulate the soft pedal effect.

    I think that sampling the softpedal is an exercise that will happen more and more in the future. Ivory has soft pedal samples and you can hear a difference.
    I also think that IR-based emulation of the overall piano soundboard will become so powerful in the next few years that you can expect a piano sample-set that uses body-less piano string samples to effectuate a convolution engine that brings the harmonic structure of the piano. In this scenario I can see a more realistic emulation of soft pedal, sustain pedal and even lid position.
    Sostenuto is a simple midi rule. Kontakt2 has a script that does the trick. I have a custom midi interface with the sostenuto logic burned in an Eprom for this.
    Code:
    IF note-on AND pedal-down 
    THEN SUSPEND note off UNTIL pedal up; 
    play all other notes as usual
    Best regards,
    Michiel Post


  7. #7

    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    See, now this is why I don't sample pianos...

    Body less string samples, lid positions!! These hadn't even crossed my mind as something you could do. Seems the only to prevent updating piano libraries is to go out and spend a lot of money on the real thing...

    I will have a play with the filter method mentioned, but I fully suspect I'll be back to ask more questions. (My GS experience extends as fair as loading and playing).

    Thanks All

  8. #8

    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    Quote Originally Posted by JonFairhurst
    Yes, and maybe adding some filtering as well. But to do it correctly, you need to sample it separately. As I understand it, modern grands slide the hammers over to hit a subset of the strings.

    -JF
    Perhaps the required filtering/EQ would be beyond a samplers ability, so it would become seperate wave material anyway, so it makes more sense to sample it again, yeah.

  9. #9

    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    What we need is a sampler that can load a different IR for each note. I don't think a single IR would do it but you could try it with all of the appropriate strings muted with little clamps. Another possibility is to use soft pedal samples but just use fewer layers.

    Howard

  10. #10

    Re: Soft Pedal Emulation In GS3

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Blaske
    OTOH, if you do invest in a quality piano and keep it maintained, it'll last you the rest of your life and never become obsolete. Add up all the hardware and sample libraries that you might buy over a decade or two to approximate a real piano, and you might have been able to have the real thing (especially if you buy wisely, and then keep your ear to the ground to trade up when an excellent opportunity to buy a great instrument presents itself).
    Hey, Lee you know I tried that but every time a sexy new piano library comes out I can't help myself.

    Howard
    Ragtime Press

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