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Topic: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

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  1. #1
    Senior Member
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    Nov 2002
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    Santa Cruz California
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    Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    Does hollywood get a whole movie, soundtrack and everything to come in under 4.7GB??? I just made a short music video that's 4 minutes long, and it's 1GB! Even lowering the quality doesn't save me much... Anyone know how they do it?

  2. #2

    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    It's actually 9.5GBs because they use dual layered discs, and the compression of mpeg2 is like that of mp3 compression, only, made for video. Which squeezes it down a bit, and also makes dark scenes look all blocky, even at variable bit rates.

    Do a google search for some codecs and you should get some decent ones.

    Which program are you using for the video editing and rendering? Final Cut Pro? An Avid rig? Windows Movie Maker?
    Lincoln Flesch
    Diva, GPO, GOS, LastLibs Bass, Scarbee's SID, BFD, Post Emperor and the MAG.
    ---------------------------------------
    "People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    --Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

  3. #3
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    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    Vegas Video 4.0... But even at dual layer, I'm only on track for 32 minutes at this rate... Yeah, I guess I'll search around some more, I'm just wondering, how do they eliminate the black blockyness if they're compressing it to Mpeg2? It's research time I guess...

  4. #4

    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelhed
    I'm just wondering, how do they eliminate the black blockyness if they're compressing it to Mpeg2? It's research time I guess...
    VBR (variable bit rate) helps, it gives more bytes to the frames that need it and less to the brighter, less complex scenes. But even your average hollywood DVD will be blocky on real dark scenes, unless it's a Superbit DVD, which looses all the extras and excess audio tracks to devote full bitrate to the picture and one audio track.

    I don't have Vegas but some members here should. Hopefully they can help you a bit more.
    Lincoln Flesch
    Diva, GPO, GOS, LastLibs Bass, Scarbee's SID, BFD, Post Emperor and the MAG.
    ---------------------------------------
    "People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    --Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

  5. #5
    Senior Member
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    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    Thanks for the reply Link, and suggestions... Bye the way, You seem to be pretty hardcore into this scene, what took you so long finding us here at NorthernSounds?

  6. #6

    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    I have been lurking for a while but never had internet at home until a couple of months ago. So it was mainly reading at friend's houses and school, the library, etc. I never joined and got an account until I had a connection at home. I'm loving it now though!
    Lincoln Flesch
    Diva, GPO, GOS, LastLibs Bass, Scarbee's SID, BFD, Post Emperor and the MAG.
    ---------------------------------------
    "People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
    --Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)

  7. #7

    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    All DVDs use MPEG-2. But save that conversion until the final dump. Keep working in AVI until then. MPEG-2 is a great delivery format, but a bad editing format.

    One of the ways that they get rid of the block artifacts is that they use excellent coders, and they have the luxury of running them in recursive modes set for top quality. Who cares if it takes a few days to render on a dual Opteron?

    Compare nice film transfers to the cr@p HDTV video from the Olympics this summer. During the backstroke closeups the water drops were square! That's what you get with cheap real-time encoders.

    In Vegas 5 (probably 4 too) you can set the average and peak data rates. I use a peak of 8 mbps and an average of 6 mbps. That gets me about two hours on a single-layer disc. I use their defaul quality setting. Coding an hour of video takes just under an hour on my Athlon64 3000+. You can set it for higher quality, but plan to render overnight. Make sure the settings are for NTSC DVD (or PAL DVD, in Europe).

    BTW, Nero is nice for burning DVDs. It doesn't put a bunch of extra junk on the disc the way that Sonic does, so you can make use of most all of that 4.7 GB. Sonic only gives you about 3.7 GB.

    -JF

  8. #8

    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    Another key is to encode your audio in AC3, or Dolby Digital format, at about 192kbps. In a two hour project uncompressed audio would take up over 1 GB. At 192kbps it only takes about 170 MB (this is for stereo files).
    For video I personally use Canopus Procoder with very good results. Mpeg2, 6Mbps average bitrate, 8Kbps max, 2-pass vbr are pretty good settings.

    Eric Matlock
    Musician/Editor
    www.sideeffects.tv

  9. #9
    Senior Member
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    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    2Hours??? holy crud, I'll die when I get 2 hours off a single-layer disc, I'll try those settings Jon, and thanks for the audio advice too eric.. This is why I love this forum, just so many ready and willing to help... Thanks so much guys... I don't see where you set a data rate in vegas though.. Hey Jon, where exactly in Vegas 5 are you setting your data peak rates?

  10. #10

    Re: Slightly off topic but, How in the hell....

    I know Vegas pretty well and it sounds like you are not rendering your film to the correct format. What program are you using for the DVD authoring? If you are using DVD architect there is a template option for rendering that formats the project to a MPEG 2 format best suited for DVDA. Select what you want to render then go to File - Render As - Save as Type - then choose MPEG 2 Mainconcept - then select the template as DVD Architect XXXX...you will have several to choose from just select what is appropriate to your project. After that Vegas will probably take a LONG time to render depending on you project so you might want to set this for overnight. You can also just choose to render to MPEG 2 without the template and import into most DVD authoring programs.

    MPEG 2 compression is pretty tight... My 10 minute films are less than 500 MB when rendered...I also render the audio separately as AC-3 which is very tight compression. But as Lincoln mentioned Hollywood uses the Dual layer discs which hold twice as much data as the standard comsumer DVDs but the good news is that Dual layer burners have hit the consumer level and you can pick one up for under $100...However, DVD architect doesn't support these yet as far as I know.

    BTW you can change the settings for the MPEG 2 compression under the Custom tab in the Render Screen...It should default to variable bit rate...Vegas 5 has an option for two pass rendering which yields a better image. You can select the Best quality setting though in Vegas 4 to improve quality also.

    Cheers!
    Edward W. Trevino
    Dandlewood Productions
    www.dandlewood.com

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