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Topic: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

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  1. #1
    andyt
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    Cool 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    As I was perusing the VSL site today and reflecting on the phenomena of the whole VSL, especially the consistent articulations and performances across all their products .... it occured to me that it might be possible for 3rd party sample developers to take advantage of the VSL performance tool.

    - What is to stop a developer creating a set of patches for their latest library that could use the performance tool to perform legato and repeated notes ?

    - obviously prsopective buyers would already have had to have bought one of VSL's libraries already, to get access to the performance tool.

    - but I can see no technical reason (currently) that would prevent the use of the performance tool on a 3rd party set of samples provided they were set up correctly.

    - obviously there is a moral and legal side to the discussion.


    ---- and then I thought bit more. With the new GS3 capabilities ... will a performance-tool-like capability already built into GS3 mean that VSL's "performance tool" competitive advantage is only valid for a few more weeks ?


    (I've no agenda here ... I'm not a developer .. I just like thinking about the business side of this industry, and the different business strategies of the various developers.)

  2. #2
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    Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    Hi andyt,

    I think it's not about the tool itself, it's more about the samples. Writing a tool for alternation for example is not a very hard task. In fact Kontakt has "round robin" and Halion may have something similar.

    The performance tool is continously analyzing the midi-input. If you play in legato mode, you have a (configurable) timespan and if two consecutive notes have note off (first note) and note on (second note) within this timespan, the performance tool is triggering a adequate legato sample for the second note. The portamento/glissandi modes work similar. So the tool is not the important part, it could easily be replaced I think, but having legato samples (transitions from one note to another) and portamento samples and such, that is the key.

    Take a look at http://www.fx-max.com/amp.html - Max is working at something similar, you *just* need the correct library

    Malte

  3. #3

    Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    Right... so if someone went to the enourmous lengths of sampling as many articulations as VSL, they might aswell do the tool aswell.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Bruce A. Richardson's Avatar
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    Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    Yes, the tool was a very nice piece of development, but the real trick is knowing how to get what you need in a session (and having the man-hours to do the back end editing).

  5. #5
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    Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    ---- and then I thought bit more. With the new GS3 capabilities ... will a performance-tool-like capability already built into GS3 mean that VSL's "performance tool" competitive advantage is only valid for a few more weeks ?

    I guess so. I am pretty sure that other samplers like Kontakt will follow to have same function.
    Kentaro Sato (Ken-P)
    Composer/Conductor/Orchestrator
    www.wisemanproject.com

  6. #6
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    Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken-P
    ---- and then I thought bit more. With the new GS3 capabilities ... will a performance-tool-like capability already built into GS3 mean that VSL's "performance tool" competitive advantage is only valid for a few more weeks ?
    As I stated above, the performance tool is a really nice piece of software to take advantage of the *performance library* VSL is offering (or the performance patches in the horizon series). So even if GS3, Halion, Kontakt or whatever might have something similar integrated in the future, you would have to buy a library that actually has the needed samples for any performance tool to work. So if GS3 has something similar, what would it be good for if you don't have i.e. a patch with real portamento samples? The tool is only for controlling which sample/articulation is to be played. So without VSL (or other library developers adding specific samples for glissandi, portamento, legato) I see no way to get the power of VSL - that is: if you really want those features, get VSL, a tool alone want help much.

    Malte

  7. #7

    Thumbs up Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    I talked to a distributor who went to NAMM when they unveiled GS3 in action. He told me that GS3 will have the MIDI tools of the Performance Tool built into itself. I don't know to what extent, but from the way he said it, it sounds like it will do everything the Performance Tool can do currently. <---Speculation Only!

    If you think about this, it makes sense for VSL to hand over these functions to Tascam. It would be alot nicer doing all of the programming in one single interface, than to do it with two or more programs.

  8. #8
    andyt
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    Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    Quote Originally Posted by MalteRathke
    As I stated above, the performance tool is a really nice piece of software to take advantage of the *performance library* VSL is offering (or the performance patches in the horizon series). So even if GS3, Halion, Kontakt or whatever might have something similar integrated in the future, you would have to buy a library that actually has the needed samples for any performance tool to work.
    Malte
    Yes, Malte ... that was my whole point. I KNOW the performance tool is useless without the correct samples. My point was that developers who wanted to develop a legato / perfromance library did NOT have develop a similar performance tool. My point was they could either;

    - rely on a user already owning the performance tool
    - or use the capabilities in-built in GS3

    I also disagree with the point that a developer may as well develop their own tool. This is a completely diffferent skill set ... and the user community would not be greatful for a proliferation of performance tools.

    I also disagree with your point about "might as well buy" VSL, on two points.

    1. I was making no assumption about re-using the performance tool for orchestral samples.
    2. I was talking about using the technology from a developers perspective.

    But thanks for your thoughts.


    If it is true that VSL have helped Tascam build performance tool like capabilities into GS3, this is a really, really interesting business strategy. A key differentiator of VSL was undoubtedly its performance / legato capabilities. This is indisputable I think.

    By handing over the performance tool technology to Tascam, they are being very generous, but they are lowering the barriers for other developers to start developing repetition / legato based sample libraries.

    I am really intrigued by their calculations to make this decision. This is a business decision, but I cannot work out why they would do it (even though I am very happy that they have.)

  9. #9
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    Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    Hmm, if all functions are covered within GS3, I think the VSL guys might offer a GS-Performance file (GSP) for GS3 users that will take advantage of the new functions within gigastudio. Although from what I hear, they have plenty of stuff on their todo-list and this could be on pretty low priority.

    Malte

  10. #10
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    Re: 3rd Party Use of VSL Performance Tool

    Hi andyt,

    sorry I just realized - before your last post - that I misunderstood one or two of your thoughts. Sorry - must be my bad english

    I just tried to make clear that I don't think VSL has an outstanding tool or some kind of revolutionary technology behind it. From a developers view (although I don't develop audio/midi applications) I'm - please don't take me wrong - pretty amused about "handing over the performance tool technology to Tascam" as from my point of view the performance tool *technology* is the very least point to worry about. I hope that I don't stink around here when I'm saying that I could develop a similar tool and I'm far away from being a *master* developer. From my understanding that is ... maybe I'm wrong.

    As I said, I don't want to offend, but giving the overall problem of creating the needed samples and playback technology, the performance tool is a pretty simple one

    Malte

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