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Topic: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

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  1. #1

    Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    Hi you lot (from a lurker),

    Anyone else think that this would be an interesting thing to have sampled? (It’s the weird “crunchy” electric sounding thing associated with V’ger.) Perhaps it’s too associated with that particular soundtrack to be useful, but it would be fun to play with anyway. Lots of other interesting FX on that soundtrack too.

    OT: Not to bash James Horner, but I caught a bit of some old film called Battle Beyond the Stars the other day on TV, and it was as if they were playing the ST:TMP soundtrack unedited. It was just unbelievable, the same unique FX, same/similar chord progressions, same exact orchestrations, almost the same exact everything. I thought maybe it was Goldsmith borrowing from himself until I heard a few bits I thought sounded too dodgy and Horner-like. Checked on IMDB and it was him. No doubt next to me he’s a genius, but he does seem to be quite hack-ish in general. And he wrote that sodding Celene Dion song.

  2. #2

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    Not to bash James Horner?? If that\'s not bashing, then I don\'t know what is.

    For my money, the score for Glory remains in my top 10 of all time.

    As far as \"borrowing\", well what working composer doesn\'t? There are these little things like test audiences...and these little people like directors and producers...who have a tad bid of input as to what the music should be.

    There are expectations. It is the rare gig that allows film composers to be truely innovative these days.

    As far as I\'m concerned, we have returned to the days of the \"Musical Director\". And that is a more proper title for composers at this time. We \"direct\" certain musical language to fit the film, according to audience expectation and edicts from directors and producers.

    As a film composer, you are a hired gun. You don\'t even own the music you have \"written\" when you are finished.

  3. #3

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    James Horner was 24 (I think) when he wrote the Battle Beyond the Stars score. It was his second film score, I believe. I think it is forgivable.

    He has always been ripping off his own stuff. Progressions, themes, fx, whatnot. I don\'t care. I still think he\'s a brilliant composer because he has done so many hours of really original music.

    Thomas

  4. #4

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    Montag, It gets better: Horner has never credited Goldsmith as an influence. Im not sure but if I remember correctly, it has affected their personal relationship in the past.

    I personally prefer Horners Star Trek scores better than his other work (Im not saying hes a bad composer)... He just uses the same old clichs all over again, but theyre good clichs.

  5. #5

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    I agree TJ. I never understood why people unbelievably can\'t stand Horner (Titanic maybe? Call me a sentamentalist, but I liked the score with the film). He\'s done some nice stuff. Check out his score to \"Iris\". Very pretty score with Joshua Bell on violin.
    I dont really care if he rips off his own stuff either, he\'s obviously doing something right or he wouldn\'t be working as much.

  6. #6

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    Hi Guys,

    Interesting that you\'re talking about Horner. I have to say I like his work even though he rips himself off all the time. However, have any of you seen \'Enemy at the Gates\'? I was watching it a few nights ago and I was SHOCKED!! I can only assume that the director temped the film with Schindler\'s List because the theme is the most obvious rip off of Schindler\'s I could ever imagine! It drove me crazy every time it appeared in the film.

    Chris

  7. #7

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    The “Musical Director” comment is interesting, perhaps that would be a more fitting (honest?) description of what he does? I’ve worked in post production and I know the schedules composers have to work with must be invariably insane. I appreciate that something like Battle Beyond the Stars was probably done with a temp mix using Star Trek, and that he was told “make it like that”. Still, I found it just jarringly similar, even in that context. I know they all steal. (Re his Star Trek stuff, I think I remember his Star Trek 3 theme being a blatant rip off from Debussy’s La Mer.)

    I guess I’m the opposite as Damon and whilst appreciating the difficulty of the job just don’t quite understand why people would rate him up with the very top composers. I wouldn’t say that I can’t stand Horner, but based on what I’ve heard would never buy one of his scores. There’s just never been anything original and magic for me. I did though, admittedly, hate the Titanic score big time. (The all time twee-est score before Lord of the Rings?) I haven’t heard Iris or Glory, perhaps they’d change my mind.

    As for him getting a lot of work in Hollywood, so do countless people that can be considered good craftsmen, but not artists (although almost everyone in that town no matter what they do seems to think they are). I guess that’s what it boils down to for me: he seems like a very competent craftsman, but I don’t see the artistry. I guess others do.

    Like I say, compared to me he’s still Dvorak.

    Just an opinion!

  8. #8

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    Originally posted by Paulh:
    [QB]Montag, It gets better: Horner has never credited Goldsmith as an influence. QB]
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">That\'s incredible to me, because there\'s a bit in \"Wrath of Khan\" where Khan is reminiscing about his days back on Earth as a ruler or emperor or whatever, and Horner does the three-note trumpet motif-Echoplex thing from Goldsmith\'s \"Patton\" score, used when Patton remembers his past lives as Alexander the Great or some such.. It comes off not as a ripoff, but as a tribute or homage, so to hear that Horner doesn\'t absolutely bow down to Goldsmith, considering that this bit of hero worship made it into the \"Khan\" score... well, I just don\'t know...

  9. #9

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    As for people copying themselves...Listen to Goldsmith\'s opening themes to Star Trek- First Contact and Air Force One: chord progression, instrumentation and overall structure are identical and interchangeable. Also compare the atmospheric \"cloud\" music in Star Trek the Motion Picture with alot of cues from Poltergeist: almost identical in the chords, string arpeggios, and especially the use of the waterphone.

  10. #10

    Re: Star Trek: The Motion Picture – Blaster Beam

    Originally posted by timzydee:
    As for people copying themselves...Listen to Goldsmith\'s opening themes to Star Trek- First Contact and Air Force One: chord progression, instrumentation and overall structure are identical and interchangeable...
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">[img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] For me Mummy 1 and 13th Warrior have a lot in common. Still nice stuff to play once in a while.

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