• Register
  • Help
Results 1 to 5 of 5

Topic: Does Aria follow GM2 Decimal Equivalent of CC numbers?

Share/Bookmark
  1. #1

    Does Aria follow GM2 Decimal Equivalent of CC numbers?

    Does Aria/JABB 3 use decimal number 77 for #131 vibrato depth? I'm trying to get my DAW's midi editor to draw in control data but it won't respond to vib. Works drawing in for volume, and if I play in the vib from the keyboard assigned to 131 but I need to draw for accuracy.

    This is in Logic 9 if anyone uses it. Logic's Hyper Editor uses decimal to create hyper sets (CC paths).
    Thanks

  2. #2

    Re: Does Aria follow GM2 Decimal Equivalent of CC numbers?

    Vibrato depth in JABB and other Garritan instruments is controlled by After Touch. If you don't have a keyboard that can send out AT, then ask for AT to be displayed in your PRV and draw it in.

    TIP: Don't just insert single values and let Vibrato waver away constantly. Use Vibrato logically: Let a note be established, and then swoop up a ramp of AT data and down again. Vibrato is only introduced on longer notes, so many of your shorter notes are best without any.

    Randy

  3. #3

    Re: Does Aria follow GM2 Decimal Equivalent of CC numbers?

    Quote Originally Posted by MJH01 View Post
    ...if I play in the vib from the keyboard assigned to 131 but I need to draw for accuracy...
    Of course you're right that CC131 is sometimes used as an AfterTouch substitute, but when AT is listed and available, it makes the job of using it more straight-forward.

    BUT something occurred to me after I wrote last night. If you're getting vibrato from your keyboard, then it should be showing up in your "Hyper Editor"-PRV/MIDI Editor. The only way I've heard of DAW software working is that if you want to work by hand with a CC not yet in a project's MIDI track, then you have to ask for that specific new lane to be inserted. But when you've recorded some MIDI data from a keyboard - then it's already there in the project. Whatever kind of MIDI editor the program has automatically has the lane with that new data displayed on it. Maybe it's hidden at first, but it has to be there.

    The logic of all this is really straight forward, face value in Sonar. Either ask for an AfterTouch lane and start drawing, or record from a keyboard and the AT lane has been automatically inserted. I'll be surprised if Logic doesn't behave in some similar way. My theory is the AT lane is there in your editor, but hidden - maybe you have to go to a menu to see what data is available for display.

    EDIT: One more possibility. After you've recorded some vibrato from your keyboard, maybe you're just not recognizing how Logic has the data labeled. In Sonar, for instance, AfterTouch is called "ChnAft" in the PRV menu.

    Randy

  4. #4

    Re: Does Aria follow GM2 Decimal Equivalent of CC numbers?

    Thanks Randy, you're a star. For what it's worth, and it might be worthwhile for newbies, my vib depth hadn't been reset from my keyboard, so it wasn't audible as an effect. I must have tweaked it in the early stages. As you correctly say it's controlled by aftertouch or C(ontrol)-Press as Logic calls it. It only took dumbo here a few hours to realize - 'hey, maybe the keyboard isn't reset'. Hence the vib rate wasn't audible either. But it's all cooking now.

    But yes you're right about the benefits of subtlety of gradually increasing vib. I majored in trumpet years ago so, yeah, you've got to get the note first. And anyway, too much vib is like Glen Miller on overdrive. And I remember an opera singer saying that he limits the amount of vib he sings with on modern repertoire which uses so much dissonance - the major and minor seconds fight with each other enough without stirring them up with widely oscillating vib - it confuses their effect if anything.

    Anyway, I've put up another thread re: shakes. Can't seem to get their top notes to respond to velocity reduction. Have you cracked that?

    All we need now is a sequencing/scoring package that's like Sonar or whatever and Finale/Sibelius combined i.e. the score looks exactly as it should, it reads all the specific CC#'s direct from the sequencing. At the moment it seems the only route is to get the performance detail in the sequencer then export via a midi file into a scoring package and hack away. I'm sure humankind has the technology to get a better workflow together than that - something I'd pay good money for!

    Thanks again - hey, should we all be using MM now?

  5. #5

    Re: Does Aria follow GM2 Decimal Equivalent of CC numbers?

    Quote Originally Posted by MJH01 View Post
    Thanks Randy, you're a star. For what it's worth, and it might be worthwhile for newbies, my vib depth hadn't been reset from my keyboard, so it wasn't audible as an effect...
    Good deal, glad you have your vibrato going on now, MJH01. But I don't really know what you mean about the "vib depth" not being "reset" from your keyboard. - ?

    Quote Originally Posted by MJH01 View Post
    ...you're right about the benefits of subtlety of gradually increasing vib. I majored in trumpet years ago so, yeah, you've got to get the note first.
    That's it in a nutshell. Sometimes people will use something like vibrato control just inserting single values - Like putting in a single value of 127 for instrument volume control, and that's all that happens for the whole track. They then wonder why their tracks lack realism--hehe. Same with vibrato - I've seen people insert a single AT value, and there go their tracks, constantly warbling, totally unrealistically. The logic is simple - If a note is long enough for a musician to hold, he's going to introduce vibrato, and that's going to glide in, even if it's a short ramp.

    Do take note that you should also use CC17 in conjunction with AT. That controls the speed of the vibrato. You can take a look in ARIA's Controls window to see the results of your data as the VibSpd knob turns.
    Quote Originally Posted by MJH01 View Post
    ...Anyway, I've put up another thread re: shakes...
    Saw the new thread, I'll be replying there also.

    Quote Originally Posted by MJH01 View Post
    ...All we need now is a sequencing/scoring package that's like Sonar or whatever and Finale/Sibelius combined i.e. the score looks exactly as it should, it reads all the specific CC#'s direct from the sequencing...
    Wanting a full tilt combination program which has all the tools for both "sequencing" and notation has long been high on the wish list for many musicians. The primary argument which says that can probably never happen is because of what it would do to pricing. Good DAW software averages in the $400-$500 range, and so does notation software. For a program to encompass everything in both flavors of software would double the cost - And that doesn't sound like a very sustainable thing to the manufacturers. The majority of DAW software users are only interested in recording, and don't have all that much interest in notation. And the inverse is true - many notation users simply want to produce professional looking scores. Having "realistic" renderings is much less important to them. Those average users aren't likely want to suddenly pay twice as much for a program which has all sorts of things added that they don't care about.

    Thinking of that business model, it seems like companies could perhaps offer a SUPER DELUXE version of their programs which Do cost $1,000+ but have entire notation as well as DAW features - and that version is available for the intrepid souls who want all that.

    Quote Originally Posted by MJH01 View Post
    ...should we all be using MM now?
    Not necessarily. A very small handful of us are posting there now, and that new forum is slowly coming to life, but this Northern Sounds Forum is continuing on, with quite a few people here looking like they're not interested spreading themselves thinner by going over to MM also. SO it's totally a personal decision. This Forum is where you're going to find the majority of online users, but the new Forum needs input - so, do what you can, what you want!

    Randy

Go Back to forum

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •